Rifles

[BFEGTO]

there has been alot of topics on handguns recently, so what about rifles? what does everyone like for cqb and longe range? and for longe range shooting what caliber do you like that is reasonable to shoot? i see alot of people talking about remington 700's but what other options are out there for reasonable prices?

[DeepBlueZ]

there has been alot of topics on handguns recently, so what about rifles? what does everyone like for cqb and longe range? and for longe range shooting what caliber do you like that is reasonable to shoot? i see alot of people talking about remington 700's but what other options are out there for reasonable prices?

CQB? you got something you want to confess to us???:huh:

:p

I'm a big fan of the AR-15 platform.


1) I have a 16" M4A2 carbine that I like to shoot at the local range (fairly short range). It's totally stock but will soon be getting a red-dot and an unpinned retractable stock (mine is retractable style, but the democrats had it freaking bolted in the fully extended position, apparantly so I can't hide it under my coat and go shoot up a school :rolleyes:).

2) For 200-300 yards, I've got a 20" heavy-barrel AR-15 A2 w/ a fixed stock, harris bipod and some civilian parts swapped out for mil-spec (bolt, bolt carrier, etc...the civilian parts make the gun much more prone to malfunction).

It's currently awaiting a little more comfortable grip and an A2 scope mount, cheek piece combination so I can round it out with a nice 4-12x scope. :D

3) For short range rifle shooting, you also can't beat an old WWII-era .30 caliber M1 carbine for "fun to shoot" factor. They're incredibly easy to become familiar with and they're fairly accurate out to a couple hundred yards. They're fairly cheap too (I picked up a nice refurbished one w/ a brand new stock and barrel for about $350.)

[John Doe]

there has been alot of topics on handguns recently, so what about rifles? what does everyone like for cqb and longe range? and for longe range shooting what caliber do you like that is reasonable to shoot? i see alot of people talking about remington 700's but what other options are out there for reasonable prices?

What are you looking to shoot? Hunting or Target? I just purchased a Remington 700 CDL in .270 after much research. You can shoot everything from Varmint to Moose and shoot nice and flat out to 300. If you want really long range your better off with 7mm Mag, or .300 Win Mag. Or you can look at the WSM in .270 or .30, but I heard several reports of excessive chamber wear with these after less than 1000 shots.
For Target I'd go with a .22-250, .243, or other hot .22 cal.

[luke0927]

Ive got several remitons semiauto's and bolt action.....love my .280 and 30-06

[odie3283]

I personally like the Remington 700's...They affordable, and very good rifles...

For long range, I like my Browning Abolt Medallion .280 with the BOSS, or my Rem 700 LSS .300 win mag...A .308 is always a good choice too...I use mine for hunting more than target, so these are a little larger because I like to make sure I have enough gun to knock my game down right away...

Smaller calibers are more recommended for just target shooting, as they are generally easier to shoot in the long run...

.22-250, .223 , .243 and whatnot are some good choices...

If I really want to get serious, my Weatherby .460 Mag will pretty much knock me on my ass ;)

[BFEGTO]

i was looking at an ar-15 the other day for fun. i was in the military for a while and feel comfortable with it. for long range i was looking at something like a remington 700 sps .308. i like the 300 and 30-06 but for range shooting the price of ammo would be crazy. we actually have a couple of ranges within an hour of me that go out atleast 700m.

[stillgreedy]

I know absolutely crap about rifles. The only thing i know is 30 off 6 whatever that is...... Maybe someone could give some info????? In terms of caliber and what different styles are used...

[luke0927]

I know absolutely crap about rifles. The only thing i know is 30 off 6 whatever that is...... Maybe someone could give some info????? In terms of caliber and what different styles are used...

what are you looking to do with it? just for target range....hunting....collecting etc....

[speeddemon]

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b331/srt4owner22 2/ak47yo.jpg

:wall:

[mkturtle]

If you are getting ready for the Zombies...
Short range: AR-15 16" M4A3
http://www.bushmaster.com/shopping/weapons/Images/ bcwa3f16m4-small.jpg
Long range: PSL
http://home.comcast.net/~pslromak3/DRAGx3.jpg

[stillgreedy]

Actually I have never hunted... I dont really know any one that does. Its a side effect of being a black guy raised in the city. I dont think I would collect rifles so I only need 3 at the most. I would like to target shoot with them and (God Forbid if something happens in Memphis like what happened in NO) have them in case someone need to be put down.

[GTOdivrMD]

i go for military stuff. cheap ammo makes them easy to shoot without wallet-pain. got a new AR-15, which is great to shoot, as well as an AK-47, also fun. great for longer range is my WWII nazi Mauser KAR98-K. also have a WWI russian moisin nagant. very loose. probably a vet of both world wars, and shows it in accuracy at range. also have a jap arisaka type 99. ammo for those is hard to find, and expensive when you find it. want to get a WWII US Garand M1, as well as the M1A/M14. those are the next purchases.

[JasonLS2GTO]

well, normaill I prefer 12ga. Shotguns, i have a black semi-auto 12ga. but I just picked up a Remington Model 710 '30-06' w/ Highpowered scope today.

[GT086]

This is the gun I want for zombie defense.

Beretta Cx4 Storm

http://www.berettausa.com/productphotos/rifles/Ber ettaCx4Storm.jpg

You can use magazines from Beretta pistols in it.

Or maybe this new Sig because I think it looks badass.

http://www.sigarms.com/images/catalog/product/SIG5 56leftside16in.jpg

It's a 5.56mm, so ammo is going to be pretty cheap and readily available.

[BFEGTO]

i have shot the beretta cx4 storm. pretty fun to shoot. but if i am getting a carbine i want a .223, thats just me though. the good thing about the beretta is if you have a 9mm pistol also it keeps you from worring about buying 2 different types of ammo.

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

<100 yards- 16" AR with EOtech
100-300 yards 20"AR with ACOG
300+ M14 with match iron sights or M1 Garand

My grab it in the middle of the night gun is a Kel Tec SUB 2000 in 9mm with Beretta mags and a Surefire G2 strapped to it.

[BFEGTO]

<100 yards- 16" AR with EOtech
100-300 yards 20"AR with ACOG
300+ M14 with match iron sights or M1 Garand

My grab it in the middle of the night gun is a Kel Tec SUB 2000 in 9mm with Beretta mags and a Surefire G2 strapped to it.

kel-tec sub2000, intersting weapon. i just looked it up, i had never heard of it before.

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

it's neat because i can keep a 16" pistol caliber rifle in my dresser drawer or under the seat of my car. it's pretty accurate out to 50 yards, and uses the same mags as my one of favorite pistols

[stillgreedy]

i go for military stuff. cheap ammo makes them easy to shoot without wallet-pain. got a new AR-15, which is great to shoot, as well as an AK-47, also fun. great for longer range is my WWII nazi Mauser KAR98-K. also have a WWI russian moisin nagant. very loose. probably a vet of both world wars, and shows it in accuracy at range. also have a jap arisaka type 99. ammo for those is hard to find, and expensive when you find it. want to get a WWII US Garand M1, as well as the M1A/M14. those are the next purchases.

Yeah i think i like your way of thinkihg........ Military style

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

not to mention that as a general rule, military weapons tend to be much closer to indestructible, and are far more idiot proof than most civilian rifles.

[jwd]

My personal favorite:

Sako Model 75 / 270 caliber / Lt Handed Bolt Action

[stillgreedy]

Yeah and cheap ammo never hurts either

[DeepBlueZ]

Yeah and cheap ammo never hurts either

Cheap ammo is a blessing and a curse. It's nice to be able to go out plinking targets all day without spending a ton on ammo, but cheap rounds usually burn dirtier, are less accurate and may or may not feed reliably in some semi-auto rifles.

don't EVER shoot that steel-cased Chinese "Wolf" brand ammunition. It's the cheapest stuff out there FOR A REASON!

At best, you won't be able to fire an entire magazine without the rifle malfunctioning, at worst....well you could cause some serious damage.

I actually had a gunsmith teach me the basics of reloading 5.56 mm way back when and I put a couple hundred rounds of did-it-myself ammo through my 20" AR (using his equipment)

If i had the money for the reloading dies, press, tools, powders and other supplies i'd definitely reload my own brass rather than ever buying commercial ammo again.

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

Wolf is Russian, not Chinese, and I'm going to disagree with you on not shooting it. I've shot thousands of rounds of it it through my AR with nary a hiccup. Yes, it's dirty, smelly, underpowered, and pretty inaccurate, but it goes bang every time, and is good enough for practice... and is dirt cheap compared to other ammo out there.

IMO 1000 practice shots of cheaper, poorer ammo will teach you more than 500 shots of more expensive ammo

[jwd]

Wolf is Russian, not Chinese, and I'm going to disagree with you on not shooting it. I've shot thousands of rounds of it it through my AR with nary a hiccup. Yes, it's dirty, smelly, underpowered, and pretty inaccurate, but it goes bang every time, and is good enough for practice... and is dirt cheap compared to other ammo out there.

IMO 1000 practice shots of cheaper, poorer ammo will teach you more than 500 shots of more expensive ammo

Perhaps - but it will not make you accurate!

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

no, but it will allow you to master your shooting positions, trigger discipline, sight picture, and failure drills. it's accurate enough to hit a man sized target out to 300 yards, it's just not match ammo

[stillgreedy]

Thanks for the info

[jwd]

no, but it will allow you to master your shooting positions, trigger discipline, sight picture, and failure drills. it's accurate enough to hit a man sized target out to 300 yards, it's just not match ammo

Excuse me - what is your application here - plinking, hunting, assault, or sniper? Lethal shot placement and hitting a target are two different concepts.

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

proper use of the weapon regardless of application relies on practice of shooting fundamentals. These can be practiced with dry fire and cheap ammo. once the fundamentals are mastered, then you can fine tune your skills with better ammo, but just going out to the range with good, expensive ammo will not make you a better shooter.

equate it to drag racing-- you can buy a car and dump thousands of dollars into mods for it, but unless you know the fundamentals of driving, you're still not going to drive for crap, regardless of what you spend on the car

[DeepBlueZ]

Wolf is Russian, not Chinese, and I'm going to disagree with you on not shooting it. I've shot thousands of rounds of it it through my AR with nary a hiccup. Yes, it's dirty, smelly, underpowered, and pretty inaccurate, but it goes bang every time, and is good enough for practice... and is dirt cheap compared to other ammo out there.

IMO 1000 practice shots of cheaper, poorer ammo will teach you more than 500 shots of more expensive ammo


Sorry, Russian (could have sworn it was Chinese)

In any case, I simply don't like it....

I couldn't get it to cycle reliably in EITHER my bushy or my Panther (w/ either the civilian OR the mil-spec parts) and I also couldn't get through a magazine worth in two of my friends' ARs (one Colt, one Bushy)

[DeepBlueZ]

proper use of the weapon regardless of application relies on practice of shooting fundamentals. These can be practiced with dry fire and cheap ammo. once the fundamentals are mastered, then you can fine tune your skills with better ammo, but just going out to the range with good, expensive ammo will not make you a better shooter.

equate it to drag racing-- you can buy a car and dump thousands of dollars into mods for it, but unless you know the fundamentals of driving, you're still not going to drive for crap, regardless of what you spend on the car


I agree that shooting anything through the gun is better than not shooting it at all in terms of learning, but i've put a few thousand rounds through both my ARs so I'm fairly familiar with their operation by now. ;)

Aside from stopping to clear a stovepipe every 10 rounds, I also don't like opening up the receiver after 4 or 5 magazines and finding what looks like half a quart of used motor oil in there.

If Wolf works for you, more power to ya...Personally, I've just had NOTHING but bad luck with it so I like to stick to ammo that's one step above for plinking (stuff like Federal reloads and such)

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

fair enough. I've actually been shooting Guat surplus lately because i got it cheaper than wolf, but when the guat is gone, if the price is right, i'll be going back to wolf because it works for me

[archerm3]

there has been alot of topics on handguns recently, so what about rifles? what does everyone like for cqb and longe range? and for longe range shooting what caliber do you like that is reasonable to shoot? i see alot of people talking about remington 700's but what other options are out there for reasonable prices?

cqb? Got to be a semi auto shotgun, hands down. I love my Benelli

Long range? Dont really matter, if you go with a bolt. You just gotta match your ammo to whatever you buy. I got a 243 Ruger that drives tacks with factory Remington corelokt bullets. I got an expensive Tikka Mastersporter ,308 that is real finicky, the best groups for store bought Ive found so far is Federal premium 150 grn (.75 MOA) but I got a friend cooked me up some handloads that shoot .5 MOA. Also got a 3006 Abolt, havent shot it yet.

My AR15 and Mini 30 I only feel comfy out to about 200yds max. Those rounds dont carry much energy past that.

If you want a cheap, all around jack of all trades, get an SKS. Or a cheap bolt gun, any manufacturer will do.
But...

If you put a scope on a rifle....DO NOT BUY A CHEAP SCOPE. I say again, DO NOT BUY A CHEAP SCOPE. A cheap scope will aggrevate the hell out of you with not being able to trust keeping its zero, no low light transmission, and fogging up. And they dont take well to the occasional bump that might happen say, snaggin in a tree, taking it out of the truck, falling off the tree you had it propped up against.

SKS, $200 +/-
Savage bolt $250 +/-
Decent scope 200+

Cheap shooting rounds 762x39, .308, 30'06, 270, .223.

[stillgreedy]

Good advice......

[BFEGTO]

whats everyones opinion ion the remington 700 sps. i was looking at the .308 with 24" barrel

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

you can't really go wrong with anything on the rem700 platform. it's a marvel of mechanical simplicity, and something that simple has a tough time screwing up. it's a great hunting rifle and target rifle, but obviously it not the best for home defense due to it's barrel length, recoil, and slow follow up shot ability

[BFEGTO]

you can't really go wrong with anything on the rem700 platform. it's a marvel of mechanical simplicity, and something that simple has a tough time screwing up. it's a great hunting rifle and target rifle, but obviously it not the best for home defense due to it's barrel length, recoil, and slow follow up shot ability


ok, i might use this as a base for long range shooting. i did some looking and found there are many mods you can do to it once i learn to shoot as well as the rifle.

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

depending on what you want the rifle for, you may want to consider the 700LTR. It's the police model, and has a much heavier stock and barrel. This will provide much more accurate shots, especially followup shots as a heavy barrel is not as prone to heat related changes in accuracy. If you're going to be carrying it arould a lot (hunting or other mobile activity) a lighter barrel will be fine, but if you're going to mainly be stationary, I would strongly reccomend a heavier rifle

[Palmer]

This is at my house. :gr_devil:

http://www.weatherby.com/_images/products/ammo/rfl _cal_bullet_7mm_rem.gif

[GTPprix]

Personally I'm a fan of the AR family for short range stuff. It's really hard to beat, tons of parts/accesories and clones that are actually as good if not better than the original in some cases.

[jwd]

proper use of the weapon regardless of application relies on practice of shooting fundamentals. These can be practiced with dry fire and cheap ammo. once the fundamentals are mastered, then you can fine tune your skills with better ammo, but just going out to the range with good, expensive ammo will not make you a better shooter.

equate it to drag racing-- you can buy a car and dump thousands of dollars into mods for it, but unless you know the fundamentals of driving, you're still not going to drive for crap, regardless of what you spend on the car



True, but going out and shooting tons of cheap ammunition will not make you a better shooter either - ammunition is a HUGE variable in obtaining better marksmanship - especially as distance to target increases. Put it this way - primer selection, make of powder, bullet weight, and bullet aerodynamics are all confounding variables that must be controlled to maximize accuracy. You can be rock steady, squeeze the trigger just right - but if your rifle has been sighted in with substandard ammunition or that is all you shoot - the shooter who controls for ballistic variability will be the more accurate - IMHO.

[stillgreedy]

Facts that I had no clue about..........

[BFEGTO]

lots of good info and opinions here, keep it coming

[stillgreedy]

Why do so many people know up the anus about rifles and I just know which end to not be on.....

[DeepBlueZ]

Why do so many people know up the anus about rifles and I just know which end to not be on.....

gotta get out there and shoot man!

[DriveTOOfast]

Rifles are a tough item to consider if you are not sure of a bunch of specific information simply because rifles cover all the territory that pistols and shotguns don't.
By far the biggest spectrum of uses.

For a "first" rifle I prefer to stay away fron semi-auto's like the AR and AK and even .22 cal rimfire semi-auto's.

If you learn to shoot with a semi-auto you tend to get into the mind set of
pull the trigger....see if you hit anything
pull the trigger again....
etc., etc.

If you happen to be in the military and need volume firepower, all good and fine, but for reasonably accurate and consistent shooting you need to take it one shot at a time. A single shot or bolt rifle will usually serve better unless you simply want to play around in the "spray & pray" mode.

Interestingly enough I found out this morning that I got 30 seconds of fame on Japanese television as an American tactical rifle shooter. Guess you can never tell where these sorts of things will end up.

3:00 to about 3:30 on the video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_8XLn2wW60

[archerm3]

Rifles are a tough item to consider if you are not sure of a bunch of specific information simply because rifles cover all the territory that pistols and shotguns don't.
By far the biggest spectrum of uses.

For a "first" rifle I prefer to stay away fron semi-auto's like the AR and AK and even .22 cal rimfire semi-auto's.

If you learn to shoot with a semi-auto you tend to get into the mind set of
pull the trigger....see if you hit anything
pull the trigger again....
etc., etc.

If you happen to be in the military and need volume firepower, all good and fine, but for reasonably accurate and consistent shooting you need to take it one shot at a time. A single shot or bolt rifle will usually serve better unless you simply want to play around in the "spray & pray" mode.

Interestingly enough I found out this morning that I got 30 seconds of fame on Japanese television as an American tactical rifle shooter. Guess you can never tell where these sorts of things will end up.

3:00 to about 3:30 on the video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_8XLn2wW60

I agree with the above statement..

I told a friend of my who knew nothing about guns and wanted to buy just one type of weapon, and I told him that first and foremost would be a shotgun. You can do most of anything with a shotgun except concealed carry. House protection? Check. Bird Hunt? Check Deer Hunt? Check. Target Shoot? Check.

Shotguns are also good for house protection as rifle and pistol bullets tend to travel though 1,2,3 walls without stopping, shotgun not so much.

[DeepBlueZ]

Shotguns are also good for house protection as rifle and pistol bullets tend to travel though 1,2,3 walls without stopping, shotgun not so much.



depends on the load. 00 Buckshot is probably a little too hot for most interior walls.

[luke0927]

I agree with the above statement..

I told a friend of my who knew nothing about guns and wanted to buy just one type of weapon, and I told him that first and foremost would be a shotgun. You can do most of anything with a shotgun except concealed carry. House protection? Check. Bird Hunt? Check Deer Hunt? Check. Target Shoot? Check.

Shotguns are also good for house protection as rifle and pistol bullets tend to travel though 1,2,3 walls without stopping, shotgun not so much.

for a shotgun Benelli FTMFW taket the plug out and 10 shots in 2.2 seconds....ask Tom Knapp he set the world record!!

[BFEGTO]

what about the mossbergs for a pump action, how are they?

[smokehouse]

I’ve been using 7.62x54 (PSL and Mosin Nagant) and 7.62x39 (AK-47 and SKS) for years now and I can say that after firing 1000’s of Wolf rounds throughout the years….its great stuff. Non-corrosive and I’ve yet to have a problem with it. As a matter of fact, not too long ago there was an article in Shotgun News about how great the Wolf and Wolf match ammo was (he was using a PSL)…

[stillgreedy]

2.2 seconds how many shotgun shells????