Kimber Quality.....lol

[bursty]

Don't shoot the messenger on this one, this has to be seen to be believed...

http://full-auto.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=54
All the reasons Kimber 1911's aren't so hot.

http://full-auto.org/styles/Arrow/imageset/icon_post_target.gi fPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 9:14 pm
by Tim
Kimber produces a constantly faulty product as evidenced by ample sources (below). I know how they became popular, they did something no one else was doing back in the 90's... offering 1911's with all the bells and whistles for a fraction of a true semi-custom 1911. At one time, many years ago they actually built a nice pistol.

Well today they have competition. Even companies like Les Baer and Ed Brown offer models in the $1,500 (or sometimes less) price range that FAR exceed the nicest Kimber ever built. The Wilsons, Baers and Browns will be fit properly.

Let's not mention that Kimber likes to put "Custom Shop" on guns that have never seen the inside of a custom shop. You can have Springfield put parts on your gun in the custom shop but they will NOT stamp the gun "Custom Shop" unless it's built from the ground up as a custom gun by their smiths. Why? Because they are protecting their brand name and image, something Kimber couldn't give two shits about.

Here are some fun threads about Kimber problems.

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=11785 1
http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=18420 3
http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=18519 3

Here are some fun Kimber pics:
Here are some fun Kimber pics:

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/Kimber/228013510.jpg

This is a "Custom Shop" Grand Raptor... http://full-auto.org/images/smilies/rotfl.gif
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/Kimber/Raptor6copy.jpg
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/Kimber/Raptor5copy.jpg
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/Kimber/Raptor11copy.jpg
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/Kimber/_MG_8756.jpg
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/Kimber/Raptor12copy.jpg


:popcorn2:

[bursty]

But that's not all.

Here are several Kimbers sitting on my local dealers shelf.

Kimber likes to use less nickel in their stainless than most other manufacturers. Why? Because it makes the steel softer and therefore saves them a few bucks on tooling (less wear). In return you get stainless 1911's that rust... all by their lonesome.

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/ultra_carry.jpg
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/tle_3.jpg
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/tle_2.jpg

There there is that wonder slide to frame fit and extractor fit...

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/tle_1.jpg

Machine marks anyone?

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/tle_5.jpg

How about markings that look like some Mexican migrant worker scribbled them with a dremel tool?

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/kimber_markings.jpg

Then, for your $900 you get one magazine with your TLE and it looks like this:

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/kimber_mag.jpg

But let's not forget about that discolored plastic main spring housing on your $900 "high end" 1911:

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/kimber_spring_housing.jpg


Yeah, I know the MSH is plastic... nice touch, eh?

Yup, refinishing a Kimber is quite a chore, about the only thing you can do to one of them is paint them because the metal sucks so badly.

peaking of crappy finishes... this guys Warrior is practically new and the finish on the safety is just about completely gone.

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m167/tharmsen/F orums/guns/Kimber/kimber_finish.jpg

http://full-auto.org/styles/Arrow/imageset/icon_post_target.gi f (http://full-auto.org/viewtopic.php?p=267&sid=c0158d9f0e0545683448905ed98c7ecf#p267)by 858 (http://full-auto.org/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=54&sid=c0158d9f0e0545683448905ed98c7ecf) on Sun Nov 25, 2007 11:47 pm


lol

[Scurvy]

IBTwolfdogs

I've heard of issues with Kimbers but I think they are the exception more than the rule. I want a RCP II badly but it is certainly not worth 1300.

[T-FATTY]

I'll buy 3 of the "other" $500 guns before i buy 1 of these.

[bursty]

I'll buy 3 of the "other" $500 guns before i buy 1 of these.

thats a no brainer

[speeddemon]

gimme a colt before any of the copies

[Bandit]

Sadly, this is not the exception. Kimber has grown quite the reputation for overpriced junk. Have they made some good ones? Absolutely, but as they say... even a broken watch shows the right time twice per day.

Kimber started out great, but what made them great was immediately cut out of the formula... they launched with frames made by the Jericho factory. Don't recognize that name? It's the factory that made frames for Bill Wilson and all Wilson custom pistols. Well not only did they have that on their side, but they also sold for $425. No, that's not a typo.

Sadly they started making their own frames, raised the prices, and over the years have continually gone downhill including filling the gun with cheap MIM parts. What do you expect?

How they charge $1,00-$1800 per pistol is beyond me. I went that route once, and after 3 trips back to Kimber my gun is retired... still not running right. I want a Raptor II like you can't imagine. That thing is pure sex... but I know it will serve a better purpose as a paperweight than a defensive pistol, so I'm not taking the chance.

Some come out flawless, which I assume Wolfdog's Kimbers would be a good example of... but the MAJORITY are defective on some level.

[speeddemon]

Jericho? isnt that something from isreal?

[paco04]

gimme a colt before any of the copies

Specifically up to and including 70 series.

[Quantim0]

I would get a Springfield way before a Kimber. I already have a Colt and it's a good gun, but it does have some QC issues. It works great, but some things slipped past the QC people. But it cost me $750 and is better then any $1k Kimber.

I have my eyes on a Springfield TRP in their black finish. Super sexual. But the $1300 price tag is a little more then I have right now.

[toxie]

I have a kimber, and I like mine. It runs good, the finish is exellent and I paid $950 for a new custom eclipse II. Mine is really reliable, and runs great. I think of it like a porche. It's high end, but not HIGH END.

It's nicer then my Glock 22, Sig 229 and HK USC, so I won't complain. As durable? No, but it's a range queen. I WOULD have preferred if it had less metal injection molded parts the it does now though. I guess that Kimber is no longer the gun flavor of the month :).

On a side note, the linked post DOES show some basic misunderstanding of the properties of steel- most notably
Kimber likes to use less nickel in their stainless than most other manufacturers. Why? Because it makes the steel softer and therefore saves them a few bucks on tooling (less wear). In return you get stainless 1911's that rust... all by their lonesome.

The lowered Nickel content DOES corrode more easily, but it makes the alloy HARDER, and MORE wear resistant. Generally speaking - the MORE stainless a material is, the SOFTER it is, and the LESS stainless it is, the HARDER it is, because nickel is soft compaired to the rest of the alloy.

Notably, the use of 200-series steels, sometimes referred to as chrome-manganese stainless, has increased recently. The most durable of these grades, including 201 and 202, contain 3.5–6.0% nickel, compared with 8.0–10.5% nickel in Type 304, the most commonly used stainless grade. Other 200-series grades, such as Type 205, use as little as 1% nickel. Recently, however, new types of 200-series steels have been developed that use little or no nickel. Lower-cost manganese, usually in combination with nitrogen, is usually used in place of nickel in these grades.

Both 200- and 300-series steels are referred to as austenitic stainless grades. While they are less expensive to produce and are often harder and stronger than most 300-series steels, the 200-series steels are also less corrosion-resistant and are more difficult to form and weld

[machinistone]

My Kimber's don't have those issues, and look flawless - they are all pre-2000 models which was back when quality was job #1 due to trying to gain popularity.

[RokX]

I used to think my Kimber Pro Covert II was the shiz. But after owning it for a year, its jammed more than my Sig Sauer 226, Glock 23, HK USP .45, HK P2000, S&W M&P45, FN 5.7mm, and Walther P22 all combined......

[twrman00]

i have one of the first custom classics and have nearly 100k rounds through it. I've replaced the slide stop with a Wilson unit. several mag failures (cracked lips,etc but never from CM mags or WC mags. Never failed to sail when asked. That's right, never. last month went shooting plates in Troy, TX , 600 rounds one day with no cleaning and no failures....and it shoots circles around my series 70

I guess like is so common now, company gets bigger and quality gets lower. that's sad, mine is a cadillac. Of course now that I've bragged, it'll surely blow up

[SICKS.OH]

i have had my eclipse Custom II for a year and a half, ~600+ rounds. I had one FRB, that i think was my fault. it was during breakin, and it was filthy.

and I did notice mine had that rust on the barrel when i first bought it.

but otherwise im happy.

[uke]

I've seen a trend on some gun forums I frequent about someone getting a nice shiney high end pistol, talking about how much they love it (usually throwing in some jab about how much better it is than a boring 'plastic' Glock)

Later on, they come back talking about all the problems/failures they have with it...but it's still a nice pistol. A $1000 shiney paperweight, but still a nice pistol.

Maybe I take a more utilitarian approach to these things than some other 'enthusiasts'. This is my priorities in choosing a gun:

Does it shoot? = good to go!
Does it fail to shoot? = no way!
Is it a shiney, popular 1911 with sexy etching and draws attention = who gives a flying crap!

I'll take an ugly reliable gun that goes 'bang!' than a sexy popular gun that goes 'click' anyday.

[BFEGTO]

i have a kimber stainless tle and love it. i picked it up from a previous owner that said he had about 700 rounds through it, and i have run atleast 1000 rounds through it without a problem. oh and mine is one with the external extractor.

[toxie]

I've seen a trend on some gun forums I frequent about someone getting a nice shiney high end pistol, talking about how much they love it (usually throwing in some jab about how much better it is than a boring 'plastic' Glock)

Later on, they come back talking about all the problems/failures they have with it...but it's still a nice pistol. A $1000 shiney paperweight, but still a nice pistol.

Maybe I take a more utilitarian approach to these things than some other 'enthusiasts'. This is my priorities in choosing a gun:

Does it shoot? = good to go!
Does it fail to shoot? = no way!
Is it a shiney, popular 1911 with sexy etching and draws attention = who gives a flying crap!

I'll take an ugly reliable gun that goes 'bang!' than a sexy popular gun that goes 'click' anyday.

Seriously, a man can't have more then one pistol? I've got like . . .twelve or so. I would NEVER carry a 1911 given a choice - but they are really fun to shoot at the range, and are real purdy to boot. You are seriously eating the vanilla ice cream and leaving the hot apple pie on the plate mang!

[solardude]

ive got a first gen eclipse pro when they were still from the custom shop with over 10k rounds thru it with no problems ever except for the crap mags that they give you with the new pistol

[wolfdogs]

Ive not had one problem. all three of my Kimbers are machined perfectly and shoot flawlessly with great accuracy... i keep them clean as my car, they look bran new with well over 600 rounds through each of them.....

kinda like those few folks that got bad vetts, gto's, porches', bmw's, etc.........

http://www.renokeo.com/mykimbers.jpg

[nsurge]

Ive not had one problem. all three of my Kimbers are machined perfectly and shoot flawlessly with great accuracy... i keep them clean as my car, they look bran new with well over 600 rounds through each of them.....

kinda like those few folks that got bad vetts, gto's, porches', bmw's, etc.........



Sucks to see these sub-par pistols... 3 Kimbers here and they have all been flawless.

[bondosgto]

gimme a colt before any of the copies

i have an orginal colt from about 1913, even stamped "property of US army". no problems, for the most part. only one miss fire, my fault tho

[Supernoma]

My Kimber's don't have those issues, and look flawless - they are all pre-2000 models which was back when quality was job #1 due to trying to gain popularity.

My dad picked up a Kimber in the 90s and its been the best shooting 1911 model he has. Sad that this is the norm for them now

[YouHolden?]

My dad is a Kimber man, although I couldn't tell you all the models he has had. I do know that he has had a problem with one of them with the way it was machined, and he has had a few problems with his mags (I believe he only uses Wilson combat mags now).
I love them, they are definitely sweet shooting 1911's (I especially like the way subcompacts handle a .45), but I would never have one as anything other than a range gun. I would feel bad every scratch I put on it.

[Bill3508]

We had a new Kimber at the shop that would not even function. The slide would not even come back all the way. The reason, the numbers engraved in the bottom of the slide were so poorly done that it was binding the firearm. Once that was ground smooth with a dremel it functioned flawlessly. There was no way the gun was test fired from the factory though and it should have never left there. That was the only real bad one we had though.

[apierce918]

how'd you get the slide off to grind the numbers if it wouldnt go back?

[toxie]

He said "All the way". You don't have to pull it all the way back to lock to disassemble it man! :)