8.1L Bucket Up grade is Complete, Details below.

[ddawson]

Some tips for converting the GTO Fuel Bucket to the 8.1L Bucket.

Parts,
8.1L GM Part Number GM#88965372 or AC Delco PN MU1312
Revised Part Numbers GM # 19133455 or AC DELCO PN MU1417
Float Sensor unit part number is GM#88965379

http://www.magnacharger.com
The Magnacharger part number is #31-12-00-026 for the H2 Hummer.
This included the;
1 Fuel Pump, In-tank, Walbro GSS340
1 Fuel Pump Inlet Screen
1 Fuel Pump Sleeve
2 16-14ga. Push On Term Female
1 Fuel Pump Discharge Hose
1 Fitting, Fuel, In-tank Pump

http://www.autoperformanceengineering.com/
APE Flexible Plastic Hose
You may also want to the get the APE Connector instead of the Magnacharger Push on Terminals.
Walbro Connector with Butt Connectors.


You will also need two small hose clamps for the above line and 1 large hose clamp for the Fuel Neck and a box of Heat Shrink Butt Connectors.

UPDATE
A seller on Ebay "ID is global-automotive" sells a complete bucket that INCLUDES the correct Float Sensor.

Also if your careful you can use the 8.1L buckets flex line and attache the GTO connector to the end of the flex line so you only have 1 worm clamp.
Thanks to those who keep finding out more information on this setup.

Picture of Finished Bucket.
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp12.jpg

Removing the tank,
http://www.lingenfelter.com/documents/gtofuelpumpu pgrade.pdf

Over View,
Remove the fuel tank and pull the GTO Bucket.
Unclip the two Connectors from the top of the bucket
Remove the C Clip from the rod and separate the upper and lower section.
You will use the Upper half on the 8.1L Bucket so place it somewhere safe.

Modify the 8.1L Bucket.
See http://magnacharger.com/pdf/manual-HummerH2.pdf
Steps 20 though 42
The only difference is you will NOT be keeping the upper half.
Don't attach the bottom cover just yet.

Now you want to use the GTO Connectors and Butt Connect them to the 8.1L wires.
Take care that you get positive and negative correct on the Fuel pump.
If you use the Magnacharger kit you will use the spade connectors on the GTO wiring.

For the Float sensor wiring,
Place both Sensors in front of you. The new one points right and the GTO one points left.
Using the GTO connector Butt connect the left wire to the left wire of the new Float Sensor.
You can verify the correct wiring by using an OHM Meter. Empty is the higher number while full is a lower number.

Now you can connect the GTO Upper half to the 8.1L lower have. Slide the rods into the bucket and use the C Clip to hold it together. Attach the 8.1L bottom to the Bucket now. To line it up correctly the GTO upper half will be at the 3 O'clock position and the Float Arm will point to the 2 O'clock position.
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp10.jpg
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp11.jpg

This was the hardest part at the time but I found a better solution.
Making the fuel line that attaches to the tank,

Use a razorblade knife and cut the tubing off the connector that attaches to the fuel tank. Do the same thing for the 8.1L 90 Degree Connector that comes off the Fuel filter.

On both Connectors sand the barbs down enough to you can get a good fit with the APR Flex Line then use a hose clamp on both connectors.

http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp16.jpg
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp17.jpg
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp15.jpg

Snap the 90 Degree Connector back into the Fuel Filter.
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp19.jpg
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp18.jpg

You're done and it's time to reassembly.

Thanks to PO04GTO and b727pic for helping me out.

I drove around town with the "You Need Fuel Stupid" flashing at me and had no problems.

I hope this help. Any questions??

[Oh4GTO]

Awesome job. Thats some skill right there. Any tests yet? How much did all of that run you?

[Displacement]

So there is a warning light that comes on when you put this part in?

[ddawson]

About $400. No WOT tests yet.

I wasn't having a fuel problem but with the new heads I wanted to make sure I would be ok when it hits the dyno for tuning.

Displacement
No the warning light is when you get low on gas. Your DIC lights up when you hit those RED marks on the Fuel Gauge.

[b727pic]

Good to see its done, and have a thread for others to follow...

Thanks Dan

[EdHenderson]

Outstanding work http://home.carolina.rr.com/ehenderson/thumbup.gif ...thanks for paving the way.

.

[Steel Chicken]

Trailblazers rule. good job and nice documentation!

[b727pic]

Should probably get this put into the Knowledge base section.....

[ddawson]

I'll give DY a heads up.

[Cool_Hand_Luke]

Great post. This is going to very helpful for me in the future.

[GTOTECH101]

Hey ddawson , where does the loose pipe go? Does it plug into the top of the sender?

[ddawson]

No. There is a hardline in the tank that it connects to.

See pictures from b727pic's site http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y183/conibell/Fue l%20System/FuelBucket10.jpg

There is another hose in the tank that attaches to the top part of the fuel bucket.

[CSiJason]

I'm assuming you put the springs back on the rods?

[ddawson]

You use the spring in the 8.1L bucket. That's why you need to use the C clip to keep the two halfs together.

[Ret NYCPD]

Attn: ddawson,

Very nice!

I'd like to do the Fuel Bucket upgrade you outlined. Could you verify these are the parts needed:

1. GM Parts:
a. 8.1L GM Part Number GM#88965372 or AC Delco PN MU 1312 (Cost = ?)
b. Float Sensor unit part number is GM#88965379 (Cost = ?)


2. Magnacharger pn#31-12-00-026 for the H2 Hummer. PN# includes the following parts:
a. 1 Fuel Pump, In-tank, Walbro GSS340
b. 1 Fuel Pump Inlet Screen
c. 1 Fuel Pump Sleeve
d. 2 16-14ga. Push On Term Female
e. 1 Fuel Pump Discharge Hose
f. 1 Fitting, Fuel, In-tank Pump

Note: Could not locate this pn# on there site. How do I locate, or order? Cost for this pn#?

3. Parts from "Auto Performance Engineering"
a. APE Flexible Plastic Hose (Correct Part = Flex Hose? $2.50)
b. Walbro Connector with Butt Connectors (Correct Part = Pigtail? $3.30)

Question: Is b the part you referred to ..... "you may also want to the get the APE Connector instead of the Magnacharger Push on Terminals"

4. Aditional parts needed:
a. 2 small hose clamps for the above line (APE Part "Hose Clamp" .60 each?)
b. 1 large hose clamp for the Fuel Neck (Clamp Size?)
c. Box of Heat Shrink Butt Connectors (any particular size?)

Question: Best place to buy b and c?

About how long would you say this project takes from start to finish?

Appreciate your undertaking this project and the o/s write-up.

Thanks!

[jasonblair]

What does this bucket thing do, exactly?

[ddawson]

Check ebay. They should be around $200 there. Otherwise it's $$$

The Sending unit cost me $100 from PO04GTO but he no longer works at a dealership.

The ebay one comes with a sending unit but I don't know if it's the right one.
It has to be short enough to fit correctly in the fuel tank.

For the #31-12-00-026 you need to call Magnacharger and order. I talked to Tony and the price was $120.

From APE the pigtail is the correct locking connector for the Walbro. It's not necessary as the #31-12-00-026 comes with push on terminals. It's just that the pigtail would be a more secure connection.

The clamps you need are much smaller then the one APE sells. I picked up two small worm clamps from Orchard Supply along with a larger one for the Fuel Neck.

A 3” clamp would be fine for the fuel neck and a small ¾” one for the hoses should be fine.

APE sells the Heat Shrink Butt Connectors but I used the ones you get from the auto parts store. 14-16 AWG size.

I would have been done in 1 weekend but I ran into the feeding tube problem. Luckily b727pic found that APE sold the hose I needed to complete the project.

At this point I could do it in a day because I’m familiar with it now. I used the LPE Fuel Pump Upgrade guide for my instructions along with the Magnacharger H2 one for the modifications. http://www.lingenfelter.com/documents/gtofuelpumpu pgrade.pdf

[ddawson]

What does this bucket thing do, exactly?

It allows you to run low on fuel without staving the fuel pump.

The GTO bucket doesn’t allow enough fuel into the bucket with a high flow pump. The pump will suck the bucket dry leaving the pump with no fuel and no cooling.

People have added holes to the bottom of the GTO bucket which fixes the supply issue but as the tank runs low the holes allow the fuel to drain out of the bucket again leaving the pump with no fuel. This is turn burns out the pump.

You can see in the last picture if you look closely that there is fuel in the bucket sitting on my driveway. No fuel is leaking out.

The 8.1L bucket allows enough fuel to enter the bucket without modification and also doesn’t allow the fuel to drain out when the fuel tank gets low.

At this point we know it can supply 500HP which is fine for me but I don’t think we know were the 8.1L bucket becomes a limiting factor again.

[Steel Chicken]

excellent work. thanks so much for doing this!

You could probably come up with a rough calculation of how much power it can support by guesstimating how much more fuel it will flow. Is the weakest link in the chain that little fuel inlet thing at the bottom? measure the inside diameter of the old and new one and that would give us a *rough* idea.

[Ret NYCPD]

ddawson,

Thank you for the additional information. Now to get my ass in gear!

[Ret NYCPD]

Really wanted to do the Fuel Bucket upgrade, but...........

1. Pontiac Parts Dept on Sat. quoted the following prices:
a. $551.12 = GM#88965372 (8.1L)
b. $167.35 = GM#88965379 (Float Sensor Unit)

2. Magnacharger
a. $120.00 = Kit pn#31-12-00-026 (not verified)

3. Miscellaneous Parts
d. $20.00 = Odds and Ends (approximate)

$860.00 = Approximate Cost for Projected Parts
$ ???.?? = Install (dependent on Doing-it-Yourself or not)

Looks like this Fuel Bucket upgrade could likely exceed $1,000.00 (grrrrrrr)

Guess I'll wait and see if "Racetronix" comes through this summer, as quoted in an e-mail response over a month ago.

[gotohmy]

Wow your dealer wants to charge you list prices, ouch. Just for example-

www.gmpartdirect.com
*88965372 $341.66

*88965379
Fuel Tank Meter Sender/Connector
SENSOR $103.75

I know fred beans prices are always competitive with gmparts direct and there are other dealers with prices even a little lower. If you look around on ebay you can find the bucket for even less then any of those options. At any rate this can be done for much less then $1000.

[PO04GTO]

Just some info, the bucket needed, can be found in most 2003 and up 6.0L and 8.1L GM trucks and all 04-05 Hummer H2's. The part numders are different but will work, since you just need the lower half.

Looks great Dan, Good write-up.

[PO04GTO]

excellent work. thanks so much for doing this!

You could probably come up with a rough calculation of how much power it can support by guesstimating how much more fuel it will flow. Is the weakest link in the chain that little fuel inlet thing at the bottom? measure the inside diameter of the old and new one and that would give us a *rough* idea.

This bucket has three inlets, I ran the walbro in the bucket with 13.7 volts sitting in only 2 inches of fuel and it never picked up air. after watching the fuel pressure gauge during my tuning, I would defiantly say this set-up would support 550 to 600 RWHP with a hot wire installed. My fuel pressure only drops to 52 psi at 6500 rpm\WOT with my current set-up

[PO04GTO]

This is what you are looking for:
http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/attachment.php?attach mentid=30930&stc=1&d=1142151010http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/attachmen t.php?attachmentid=30929&stc=1&d=1142151004

[Ret NYCPD]

Can't search various sites by part number. Found 2 that allowed pn search.
Fred Beans Parts (forum sponsor) was the lowest I found.

$303.08 (MSRP $551.12) = GMC pn 88965372 (Module K1) at Fred Beans
$92.04 (MSRP $167.35) = GMC pn 88965379 (Sensor) at Fred Beans
Total saving over MSRP = $323.35
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Little confused on meaning of GTO Fuel Bucket to "8.1L Bucket"
Just to double check, is the description of the above pn's (Module K1 and Sensor) the correct parts for this conversion?
-----------------------------------------------------------------
$540.00 = approx. parts. Down from approx. of $860.00.
Plus unknown $ for install. Don't believe I can do it myself.

"Racetronix" upgrade approx $250.00 (per article in March issue of High Performance Pontiac), but who knows if this will happen in summer of 2006, or ever. If it did wait, and say install was $250, that would be a considerable savings.

Tough choice, knowing our fuel bucket sucks.

[PO04GTO]

Little confused on meaning of GTO Fuel Bucket to "8.1L Bucket"
Just to double check, is the description of the above pn's (Module K1 and Sensor) the correct parts for this conversion?
Yes, the term we use is "bucket". but it is the fuel pump module. the sensor is the fuel level sender, they are not sold together.

"Racetronix" upgrade approx $250.00 (per article in March issue of High Performance Pontiac), but who knows if this will happen in summer of 2006, or ever. If it did wait, and say install was $250, that would be a considerable savings.

Tough choice, knowing our fuel bucket sucks.
I would be very intrested to see this kit. Is it a complete Module or just another drop-in for the factory bucket? if thats the case, I would rather spend the extra $$ to be able to use the whole gas tank instead of 1/4 tank being my new empty

$540.00 = approx. parts. Down from approx. of $860.00.
Plus unknown $ for install. Don't believe I can do it myself.
Don't want to hit you with a left hook if you are taking a beating on this price, but don't forget to add the cost of the walbro kit $125
And if you have basic hand tools, this install is very easy.

[PO04GTO]

And Fred beans prices on these parts is unbelieveable, They are 10% over dealer cost:eek2: how are they makeing any money? if you are considering this mod, you better jump on at least the sender. before they go out ot business. :gr_jest:

The bucket you should try to find used first.

[ddez]

You guys might want to check out eBay item #8043464894, I just bought the 8.1L fuel pump assembly pn#88965372 for $196 including shipping.

Dave

[Ret NYCPD]

Attn: P004GTO

Agreed about the 1/4 Tank being the empty mark. Not cool!

Summary of the "Racetronix" Kit...... Chris White (GTPprix) wrote an article called "Fueling the Fire" in the March 06 issue of High Performance Pontiac magizine. This was a proto-type pump (pn#RX-VX-FPK approx $250). The only visual difference between old and new fuel bucket on the outside... additional venturi on the pump body to keep the fuel bucket full, and the pump supplied with fuel under high load situations. Further stated..... though this is the only externally visible change, there are quite a few on the inside (dosen't state what) to make this pump function better than stock. In addition, 60-pound Motorton injectors were also used. Apparently with these mods.... fuel presure also held rock-steady at 57 psi throughout the pull.

Since Chris had a ProCharger in this vehicle, as do I..... this was a very interesting article, considering the various topics related to Fuel Bucket problems. Don't know if this resolved the 1/4 tank issue, was not stated.

Possibly Chris could give us more info and how the unit is doing to-date.
---------------------------------------------------
Based on Pontiac wanting to charge MSRP cost .... Fred Beans cost, a saving of $320+ and Dave (ddez) reference to e-bay price.... looks like there is a hefty and healthy mark-up on parts to meet everyone's satisfaction, except the consumer (grrrr).

Going to e-bay and try to locate the pn Dave quoted.

Thanks to all!
-----------------------------------------
Update: e-bay pn 8043464894 from Dave (ddez) found. There were 3, now 2. Cost $180. Seller has to let me know the Tax and S&H total. Now to get the other parts.

[b727pic]

Attn: P004GTO

Agreed about the 1/4 Tank being the empty mark. Not cool!

Summary of the "Racetronix" Kit...... Chris White (GTPprix) wrote an article called "Fueling the Fire" in the March 06 issue of High Performance Pontiac magizine. This was a proto-type pump (pn#RX-VX-FPK approx $250). The only visual difference between old and new fuel bucket on the outside... additional venturi on the pump body to keep the fuel bucket full, and the pump supplied with fuel under high load situations. Further stated..... though this is the only externally visible change, there are quite a few on the inside (dosen't state what) to make this pump function better than stock. In addition, 60-pound Motorton injectors were also used. Apparently with these mods.... fuel presure also held rock-steady at 57 psi throughout the pull.

Since Chris had a ProCharger in this vehicle, as do I..... this was a very interesting article, considering the various topics related to Fuel Bucket problems. Don't know if this resolved the 1/4 tank issue, was not stated.

Possibly Chris could give us more info and how the unit is doing to-date.
---------------------------------------------------
Based on Pontiac wanting to charge MSRP cost .... Fred Beans cost, a saving of $320+ and Dave (ddez) reference to e-bay price.... looks like there is a hefty and healthy mark-up on parts to meet everyone's satisfaction, except the consumer (grrrr).

Going to e-bay and try to locate the pn Dave quoted.

Thanks to all!
-----------------------------------------
Update: e-bay pn 8043464894 from Dave (ddez) found. There were 3, now 2. Cost $180. Seller has to let me know the Tax and S&H total. Now to get the other parts.

We have been waiting for the Racetronix set up for over a year. The company is non responsive to most requests for updates. Chris was pretty much convinced they were going to proceeed with the GTO plan, intel has been very hard to come by......I am sure the availability of their new solution will be made right after I install $1K worth of "OTHER" fuel pump related goodies.

[Ret NYCPD]

"OTHER" fuel pump related goodies???????????

[ddawson]

He is going to a complete custom setup that confuses me. LOL

John did you get my PM to ebay?

[b727pic]

"OTHER" fuel pump related goodies???????????

the 8.1L bucket setup will not support big HP #'s, what the absolute HP limit is I am unsure... depends on who you talk to and whether they are NA or FI. A Walbro/ 8.1L bucket/BAP should support mid to high 500's....Lingenfelter claims higher than that??????

Those of us pushing 600+ are forced to look at other solutions for fuel delivery...ie sumped tanks, booster pumps, return systems, filters, etc....

Assuming my current plan works as designed, I will post my findings..
several weeks away, just got news my shortblock will be ready to ship this week, unfortunately my schedule and theirs confilict.....more later!!

[Ret NYCPD]

Attn: ddawson

Yes got your e-bay reference. Thanks!

All parts have been ordered, except from Magna Charger.

Spoke with Tony n the early am Monday. Gave him the part #. He was going to check and call back. Didn't hear from him..... called again in the early pm... he said he had to check with someone but didn't see a problem, and would call me back. Left for bowling around 8 est, returned home about midnight..... no call or message from Tony. Will call him today (Tues).

Hopefully the part is available, if not, am I screwed?

Spoke with Pontiac Parts Mgr yesterday (Monday)...... asked why they are charging MSRP.... told that is what Pontiac wants, maybe he meant that dealership. MSRP of $551 .... Fred Beans cost $303 and e-bay at $180....... Dam, seems MSRP has almost a 300% mark up based on the $180..... That's a big saving..... I can buy you a couple of beers (lol).

Will let you know what happens with Tony?
---------------------------------------------
Update: Spoke w/Tony.... part ($120+SH) sent.... should receive it this coming Monday 03/20/06

[bobco]

Dan, Excellent work and info on this fuel bucket mod :thumbs: ! I'm happy to report that mine holds 62psi all the way to 3000rpm. Now for the tune..... :D

[ddawson]

Ttt

[GOATHEAD55]

Slick

[ddawson]

Updated to include some new information about the float and flex line.

[1stGOAT]

Just to add new info to this great post. SoCal Goat and 24v just completed this mod and shared with me their source for the 8.1 bucket AND it turns out that the one they have ordered actually has the correct sensor. I just received mine today. Cost was 196.00 including shipping. Info shared with me..........

================================
Here's the pump(s)/bucket(s) we bought.
Advertised as an MU1312 but really a MU 1314 which was fortunate in that it came with the proper fuel float sensor.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-DELCO-FUEL-PUMP-2004-2005-SIERRA-SILVERADO-MU1312_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33555QQihZ006QQi temZ160032326352 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-DELCO-FUEL-PUMP-2004-2005-SIERRA-SILVERADO-MU1312_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33555QQihZ006QQi temZ160032326352)

He shipped it right away and I had it in 3 days. Ditto for me

You will also need an extra length of flex line and two hose clamps to make the line between bucket and fitting in tank
http://www.autoperformanceengineering.com/ - look under fuel pump / install
APE Flexible Plastic Hose
2 hose clamps
================================

I did mine last night - the instructions are fantastic - just follow them. And as 24v told me.... which I am glad he did... you can access the tank by removing cage, straps, filler neck etc and pulling it back a bit and rocking it toward you (tank stays in trunk and connected). This made it WAY easier that having to disconnect fuel lines and remove tank from car. Best tip. A novice like me took about 4 hours of labor just because it was the first time. I could do it MUCH faster now.

[b727pic]

accomplished most of the 8.1L mod today without any 3rd party kits. All parts came from APE. I took the photo below so folks can see the difference in pickups between the pumps. The 8.1L pump itself is actually quite a bit larger than either our factory pump or the Walbro. Would be curious to see just what those 8.1 pumps flow?????

8.1L pump (left) Walbro GSS340 (center) GTO OEM (Right)

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y183/conibell/Fue l%20System/8-1.jpg

[b727pic]

Always great to see folks sharing knowledge for sure. . .

Hey Sarge, glad to see more posts from ya.....I kinda miss the ole days!Lol

However.....I just dont understand all this money and time being spent on this upgrade when the fuel bucket mod and a Walbro pump has solved this issue. I maintain a rock steady 62lbs of FP all N/A at 500RWHP and a shot of giggle juice well over 625RWHP

Which "bucket mod" did you do??
I was up for drilling a couple holes, but I wanted some flappers or check valves to keep what was in from leaving except through the pump....looked high and low came up empty....

Oh well.....guess if folks run around all the time on empty it would become an issue.....just curious....and in the spirit of constructive discussion.
one thing about the bucket mod, it does have a significant larger capacity than the OEM's, it has two check valve ports on the bottom, and still retains the venturi system.....

I agree this is not an inexpensive venture, but I wonder what Racetronix (or any other vendor for that matter) would have charged for a plug and play replacement? I really don't know, seems some of their F body stuff is mid to high 2's for a pump and harness? throw in a newly designed bucket I think we would be spending the same or more???

In my case, I just hate doing things over and over. talk about expense, my approach is a bank buster to be sure, but I think I will be doing it once, and not have to worry about going lean with 15 pounds of boost on the table:bomb:

[1stGOAT]

Hey Sgtgeek can you share spec and source of the fuel line your replaced. I would like to buy one if there is a place to order one. We can add it to the list of things to do when you do this mod. I assume this is the short line you see underneath the car.

[1stGOAT]

https://ishare.ucr.edu/larry/Public/GTO/8_1Bucket_ a.JPG
https://ishare.ucr.edu/larry/Public/GTO/8_1Bucket_ b.JPG

[b727pic]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/sgtgeek/fue lbucket2.jpg


is that you Wilson???....Lol Guess you would have had to watch "Home improvement" to get that one.

Thanks for the info Sarge....What amazes me is that apparantly you are using the OEM fuel system from the rear quick disconnect forward and getting great results from a 3/8th line without all the complexity of the return/regulator setups.......Congrats!

[b727pic]

https://ishare.ucr.edu/larry/Public/GTO/8_1Bucket_ a.JPG
https://ishare.ucr.edu/larry/Public/GTO/8_1Bucket_ b.JPG
Nice pics larry......

[b727pic]

And for your amusement....We have a new ProCharger sitting in the boxes out in the shop....do you know of anybody with experiance installing one of them thar doohickeys b727pic? :)

Nope don't know anyone like that.....Good luck:gr_jest: :gr_jest:

[JayC'sG]

Wanted to get an update from those that have this mod. Any problems/issues, and it is sustaining good FP at 500+ rwhp?

Also, who is a good source for the Magnacharger pump kit?

[ddawson]

I have not been past 500HP and no issues with the Fuel System maintenance wise.

[1stGOAT]

I have not been past 500HP and no issues with the Fuel System maintenance wise.'

Seems to be working fine for me. 600rwhp but I also have Alky and KB boosta.

[Ret NYCPD]

No problem. 577 rwhp; AlkyControl (100% Meth used); High Flow Fuel Rails; 60# Injectors;

64 psi at Idle and 61-62 psi at WOT

[caritter3]

Excellent work!

[JayC'sG]

Okay, thanks for the feedback. I feel much more confident with this now that there's some first hand experiences.

[b727pic]

After much searching and calling, finally came up with a rubber submersible hose that can be used as an alternative to the plastic hoses, its rated to 100PSI. Gates makes it, but good luck finding it. I wound up getting it from Napa on line....pricey little devil @ $20.00/ft :The_Villa I utilized this from regulated pump output to the hard line connection in the tank.

[JayC'sG]

After much searching and calling, finally came up with a rubber submersible hose that can be used as an alternative to the plastic hoses, its rated to 100PSI. Gates makes it, but good luck finding it. I wound up getting it from Napa on line....pricey little devil @ $20.00/ft :The_Villa I utilized this from pump output to the hard line connection in the tank.

Why change it? Degradation of the plastic in the petrol?

[b727pic]

Why change it? Degradation of the plastic in the petrol?

Personally I think the plastic tube is a little on the light side....However I did use the cheapie plastic from the pump to the regulator assembly. basically I just wanted a little longer hose from the bucket to the hard line....not a necessity at all, just an option should someone be looking for an intank rated hose.

[JayC'sG]

bump - update again.

Issues/results?

500+rwhp what's the PSI holding at WOT and idle.

[mistermike]

After much searching and calling, finally came up with a rubber submersible hose that can be used as an alternative to the plastic hoses, its rated to 100PSI. Gates makes it, but good luck finding it. I wound up getting it from Napa on line....pricey little devil @ $20.00/ft :The_Villa I utilized this from regulated pump output to the hard line connection in the tank.

I'm going to be using Viton tubing for my "wonder pick up" setup. Less than half the price of the Gates stuff. I'm not sure what kind of pressure it's good for, but McMaster has it in two different durometers and numerous I.D's.

[ddawson]

Well it's been a year now and no problems. I run the tank low all the time.

I did add a KB BAP while I was chasing a FP issue but I was the gauge.

The new AutoMeter gauge shows 64 PSI most of the time. It doesn’t drop below 62 PSI even with the BAP turned off at 500HP and Meth.

I keep the BAP at 5 just to keep things in good working order.

[1stGOAT]

Mine has been in 6 mos.
No problems.
60 psi ..... drops to low 50's momemtarily under hard acceleration but seems to be no A/F issues.
Have Meth, 42# injectors and a KB Boosta.

[Clueless]

bump..... for updates from you guys

GM dealership here in Houston wants $460+ for the 8.1 bucket (88965372) and almost $200 for the float sensor (88965379).

GM Parts Direct online is $234 & $96 for each respectively. Any better deals out there?

How much is the Magnacharger pump kit (31-12-00-026)? I'm still waiting on a reply from them.
So, no one on here ever decided to sell a turn-key, pull-it out & drop in new assembly to sell ?

[LS2PWR]

bump..... for updates from you guys

GM dealership here in Houston wants $460+ for the 8.1 bucket (88965372) and almost $200 for the float sensor (88965379).

GM Parts Direct online is $234 & $96 for each respectively. Any better deals out there?

How much is the Magnacharger pump kit (31-12-00-026)? I'm still waiting on a reply from them.
So, no one on here ever decided to sell a turn-key, pull-it out & drop in new assembly to sell ?


I was told the new part number for the 8.1L bucket is MU1417.

You can find it on ebay, This is the seller: global-automotive (http://myworld.ebay.com/ebaymotors/global-automotive/)

He currently has one for sale here: Item Number 160120992495 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-FUEL-PUMP-2004-2007-CHEVROLET-SILVERADO-MU1417_W0QQitemZ160120992495QQihZ006QQcategoryZ335 55QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem)

I just bought one for about $180 shipped and I believe it has the correct float sensor.

The Magna Charger pump kit is about $150.

The whole thing should cost you about $300-350.

[JayC'sG]

I bought one for $150, and the pump kit for $124. I have had mine in about 3 weeks. I start at about 62psi and never dip below 58. I'm also running an MSD pump booster. I'm quite happy with it. The pump is barely louder than stock.

[ddawson]

LS2PWR, Once you verify it's the correct part number let me know and I'll add the number to the parts list.

Thanks,

[Clueless]

I was told the new part number for the 8.1L bucket is MU1417.

You can find it on ebay, This is the seller: global-automotive (http://myworld.ebay.com/ebaymotors/global-automotive/)

He currently has one for sale here: Item Number 160120992495 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-FUEL-PUMP-2004-2007-CHEVROLET-SILVERADO-MU1417_W0QQitemZ160120992495QQihZ006QQcategoryZ335 55QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem)

I just bought one for about $180 shipped and I believe it has the correct float sensor.

The Magna Charger pump kit is about $150.

The whole thing should cost you about $300-350.

I checked out this e-bay site and I notice the bucket assembly works for a large number of GM vehicles listed with various displacement engines, some smaller than the LS2. One of the displacement engines listed is the 8.1 L (496 cid). Is this where the 8.1 L nickname comes from? Here all along I figured the 8.1 L nickname was from the actual bucket volume without anything in it. Can someone confirm this or shed some light on this?

How many people have bought this bucket listed in the quote and know it to be the correct part?

[stevedelegard]

Bump for ddawson ! followed the instructions and it worked perfectly.
The thirsty machine is well satisfied.

[Clueless]

I swear I think this group of folks have modified these cars more than any other car ever made :) I always enjoy seeing some of the guys ( yours for sure) documentation of their mods.....This fueling issue sure has been addresed with both low tech and high tech solutions hasn't it.
We did the bucket mod aka drill holes in the sides and bottom and a Walbro pump.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/sgtgeek/fue lbucket2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/sgtgeek/fue lbucket.jpg
Fast fuel rails and of course injectors....we have found the most consistant ( Now 4 GTO's...couple of 04's and couple of 05's) fuel starvation issue is the crimped or bent factory fuel hose coming out of the tank connecting to the fuel line....everyone of the Goats that I have seen being modified all had this crimped line from the factory. Severe restriction for sure....Here I got some pics somewhere...
Here is the factory "hose"....
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/sgtgeek/fue lbucket4.jpg
Here is a side by side of what we are replacing the factory hose with....
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/sgtgeek/fue lbucket3.jpg
And here is the replacemnent/upgrade hose in place.....the light blue is of course the battery cable if your curious....dark blue is the fuel line...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/sgtgeek/Exh aust2Medium.jpg
I was like yourself...waiting on RaceTronix....couldnt wait forever :)
We watch the FP closely as well as A/F....WOT stays at 62lbs of FP....maybe a little "blip" for a split second down to like 59lbs but instantly goes right back to 62lbs....with no effect on A/F.
I was mainly curious if the only concern for going the 8.1 bucket route was the fuel level concern.....that concern is probably over rated....as for the bucket allowing fuel to flow back out thus emptying the bucket....Well....even at idle with 62lbs of pressure...the pump consistantly draws fuel into the bucket with far greater pressure than gravity can overcome....IMHO of course :)....and the fuel level issue....we measure ( and hopefully you can see) the holes are around a 1/4-3/8 inch from the bottom of the tank....and with the suction from the pump...your going to have to run your gas tank down to dadgum near empty to have a issue....
I do like this 8.1 bucket mod for its "factory" or should I say "original design" type upgrade versus my "get the drill motor" mod :)
Yes going lean sucks....cuz then you have to get the engine hoist out and of course you break the factory oil pressure sending unit there in the far back....and it is a PITA to replace after you find out it "broke" after you have dropped the new engine in the bay:)
Great alternative fuel mod this 8.1 bucket and great string here....very informative. And check your fuel line coming out of your tank!

Drilling holes in the bucket sides and bottom???????????? Doesn't that defeat the purpose of the 8.1 L bucket upgrade to begin with? Isn't the purpose of the 8.1L bucket to hold a larger volume of fuel around the pump (due to filling of bucket with the eductor/venturi port from the returned fuel) to prevent fuel starvation (lean condition) and to offer cooling to the pump? The drilled holes defeat both of these benefits in my opinion. Sounds like someone with the "drilled bucket" mod had better keep their tank full as much as possible.

Am I missing something here? Drilling holes sounds like a bad idea.

[04 Impulse]

Am I missing something here? Drilling holes sounds like a bad idea.


Those holes are drilled in the stock bucket, this way no need to change the stock bucket to the 8.1 bucket. He did that to just pull the fuel from the tank. Only problem with that would be if you ran the fuel low the pump wouldnt be able to rely on the fuel that stays in the bucket, I never let my car go below 1/2 or 1/4 on longer trips anyway.

[ddawson]

Updated for new part numbers.

Of course if anyone finds something wrong please PM me.

[Clueless]

Updated for new part numbers.

Of course if anyone finds something wrong please PM me.

Thanks

[Willow]

Dumb question, but I've been reading up on fuel supply lately and I can't find a definitive answer to this: Do we know the power limit to the 8.1 mod? I used to be roughly 620 at the crank. I'm sure my mods are going to bump that up now since i've added more flow, boost and a cam.

Any help appreciated. I'm on the stock pump and a magnavolt (gulp).

[stevedelegard]

I have been running the setup as described by ddawson for 7 months now. Not a single problem so far.

[JayC'sG]

I'm at 550hp and the wheels ~ 600-ish at the crank and no issues w/a B.A.P. 61psi - rock solid.

[Clueless]

Don't be surprised if the Magnacharger salesman acts confused and has never heard of the H2 pump kit being modded for the GTO. He asked what it was going in and I made the mistake of telling him. :confused: I kept telling him this was not for the GTO but for the H2 Hummer or Chevy Truck and was being adapted for the GTO.

Had a hard time getting him to tell me what all the pump kit included, but finally got an order in for the 31-12-00-026 pump kit listed. Everything as listed in #1 post.

[ddawson]

LOL sometimes you need to think outside the box. Can't blame them though as he was just making sure you were getting the right part.

[global-automotive]

Hello GTO drivers,

This is owner of GA.

Many requests have come in about this fuel pump module conversion.

As many know, we sell the MU1417 GM module which contains the larger bottom base or bucket.

We are intersted in possibly aquiring a list of parts and components required for this modification, so that we may provide a "kit" that can possibly be more economical for GTO drivers. Photos of these components would also be helpful.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Kevin

[Owe5Goat]

Hello GTO drivers,

This is owner of GA.

Many requests have come in about this fuel pump module conversion.

As many know, we sell the MU1417 GM module which contains the larger bottom base or bucket.

We are intersted in possibly aquiring a list of parts and components required for this modification, so that we may provide a "kit" that can possibly be more economical for GTO drivers. Photos of these components would also be helpful.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Kevin

It would appear everything you need is in the first post of this thread. I would be interested in a kit should you build one.

[ddawson]

Kevin, if you have any detailed questions let me know but everything is outlined in the 1st post.

It takes to Fuel Systems to create one that we need.

[global-automotive]

Kevin, if you have any detailed questions let me know but everything is outlined in the 1st post.

It takes to Fuel Systems to create one that we need.

I can get all components for the MU1417. My idea is to create a kit that will not require you to buy the complete module. Hope this makes sense.

I need to know what components are needed from the MU1417 module that you use for the conversion?

It looks like you use a high pressure Walbro fuel pump that you purchase else where. So it is safe to say that you do not need the original fuel pump that comes inside the MU1417 module. It also looks like the top of the MU1417 is not needed. This will cut down on cost if a kit were to be developed.

Thanks
Kevin

[ddawson]

The bottom without a fuel pump and the sensor are needed. The rest is tossed in the trash.

[Clueless]

Hey GA,

Like you said. Your whole bottom part of the MU1417 + (you'll probably still want to sell it whole because we need the bucket, sensor/sender, float, but the very top gets tossed)

Magnacharger's Hummer pump kit, part number is listed in post #1 +

APE's clear plastic submersible corrogated flex hose & hose clamps.

I dont think any of APE's other products would be required. Can someone comment? I had HPE do mine and they did not need the electrical pigtail connector from APE.

[Jontall]

I'd like a Walbro #340.

[Clueless]

I'd like a Walbro #340.

That's included in Magnusons Hummer Pump kit in first post.

[global-automotive]

The bottom without a fuel pump and the sensor are needed. The rest is tossed in the trash.

Do you need the floater? What about the spring inside the bucket? Also, the upper assembly of the MU1417 has a plastic bottom that goes inside the bucket. Do you need that too?

Sorry for all the question, but just trying to get an idea.

Thanks
Kevin

[global-automotive]

Ok, from what I can see you need the complete MU1417 module except the top and fuel pump. Is that correct?

Here is my list of components:

1. bucket
2. bucket spring
3. plastic fuel pump resovior
4. fuel filter with regulator
5. metal compression tubes (guides)
5. anything I missed?

Thanks

[nesikachad]

Kevin,

Buddy, if you can put one of these together in a hurry, I will be your first customer.

I'm sick and tired of pulling my hair out of my head trying to track folks down who have these parts. One stop shopping is definitely the answer.

I'm in Iraq right now and don't return until a week from today. Is there any chance you could have this thing done by then?

My cell over here is: 914 822 2971 (NY state area code)

It's either I do this, or I'm going to drop over 2k on a Nasty performance set up. Nice stuff, but man that's pricey and I don't think I need it yet.

Appreciate the help.

[nesikachad]

On another note, out of curiosity, what is the biggest/baddest fuel pump a guy can cram into this bucket?

Is the Walbro 340 it?

Also, does the "340" part mean 340 lph?

[Clueless]

On another note, out of curiosity, what is the biggest/baddest fuel pump a guy can cram into this bucket?

Is the Walbro 340 it?

Also, does the "340" part mean 340 lph?

I'm no expert on this so others need to comment. The 340 should be a 255 lph pump. Not sure if thats as big as you can go with in the bucket.

[nesikachad]

Ok.

If that is indeed the case I already have two of these.

Anyone need one? brand new!

[Jontall]

Ok, from what I can see you need the complete MU1417 module except the top and fuel pump. Is that correct?

Here is my list of components:

1. bucket
2. bucket spring
3. plastic fuel pump resovior
4. fuel filter with regulator
5. metal compression tubes (guides)
5. anything I missed?

Thanks

Double check with DDawson. How soon can you have these ready for sale and what's the price? I'm desperate for fuel. Thanks.
John

[KingGTO]

nice work

[Jontall]

Ttt.

[nesikachad]

Global, where you at?

[ddawson]

Kevin, shoot me a PM with your contact information.

I'm willing to build you the kit if you provide all the parts.

I'll document the whole thing so you can reproduce them. The big question for you will be if you will need cores to make the kits or use two new fuel systems to create one.

I won't be creating these for others because of tome, work and family but if someone else can build them I'd be happy to help.

I'm currently on the road and will be back in the office on Thursday.

[Jontall]

Calling all Global...

[camaross305]

i too am interested in these "kits" someone put one together.....i could get a nasty setup but i dunno if i wanna drop that kinda money.

[nesikachad]

Earth to Global
-break-
Earth to Global over
-break-
Global, if tangos are in the wire, -break- just key the mic over
-break-
I think we lost him
GAME OVER?

[05Judge]

bump......Interested in this kit...any work yet?

[ddawson]

Nada, I think once Kevin saw it wasn't a simple swap they walked away.

[05Judge]

I really need this kit....i guess i'm gonna have to part it together like everyone else did.

[zachd]

Brining this thread up from the dead. Thanks for the excellent write up!!! I'll be using this information once I get all the parts listed above next week.

[JS1965]

So has anyone felt like making the kit and DOES IT REALLY WORK ;)

[stevedelegard]

So has anyone felt like making the kit and DOES IT REALLY WORK ;)


Guys - this is the real deal. Printed out the instructions and gave to my installer.
He followed exactly and it's effin' great !
Have been running this setup through 42 lb injectors with P1SC
for a year now. Got the bucket from eBay - Silverado bucket & pump kit from Magna
Note - the Magna kit is no big deal, and they don't want to sell to you if you don't own a Magna Charger.
You can get the bits separately.
If you are doing forced induction or even a big bad normally aspirated motor - do not starve it.
Trailblazers rule -thanks DDawson !

[ddawson]

Just wanted to add a little update. I made a couple of these for a few select friends.

The Global Automotive Fuel assembly makes life a little easier. You can remove the fuel delivery line from the top of the 8.1L assembly and add the GTO specific connector to the end of it. That way only one clamp is needed.

Other than that my setup is still running strong.

[Owe5Goat]

Just wanted to add a little update. I made a couple of these for a few select friends.

The Global Automotive Fuel assembly makes life a little easier. You can remove the fuel delivery line from the top of the 8.1L assembly and add the GTO specific connector to the end of it. That way only one clamp is needed.

Other than that my setup is still running strong.

I am truly honored. Can't wait to put it in.

[zachd]

I did the kit and have a Walbro 255 installed with 60# injectors, I am making 560/505 to the rear and I am maxing out my fuel.

However I dont regret doing it at all, was well worth the money

[barkingspud]

Earth to Global
-break-
Earth to Global over
-break-
Global, if tangos are in the wire, -break- just key the mic over
-break-
I think we lost him
GAME OVER?

You really are in your own little world over there aren't you?

[rednari]

This is a good write up, but you guys can save a lot of time and money as follows. When I upgraded to the 255 Walbro, I new that fuel flow into the canister (module) might be a problem. So, I drilled the usual holes in the bottom and side of the canister to increase flow to the new pump. The performance was as noted here, the car received sufficient straight line fuel but suffered fuel starvation in tight turns.

My intial thinking was to dig up this old posting and redo the fuel module. But I remembered something from my racing days, and decided to add foam to the tank instead. Foam is sold in bricks, sections about 16x4x2 inches, and can be purchased from Jegs, Summit, or other performance parts supplier. I bought four foam bricks, and packed them in around the module. Viola! no more starvation problems in tight turns.

Also, keep in mind that if you pack the tank full of foam, it will stop the tank from bursting and spewing fuel. The tank will still leak after an accident rupture but will not burst fuel. The use of foam will protect the tank enough so that it becauses plausible to remove the heavy tank guard and save some weight, in addition to providing a cost effective prevention to fuel starvation problems.

[Ret NYCPD]

Few Years back completed the 8.1L...... Thanks ddawson!

Can this be upgraded to a Full Return System, and if so, what would be necessary to do it?

[nesikachad]

This is a good write up, but you guys can save a lot of time and money as follows. When I upgraded to the 255 Walbro, I new that fuel flow into the canister (module) might be a problem. So, I drilled the usual holes in the bottom and side of the canister to increase flow to the new pump. The performance was as noted here, the car received sufficient straight line fuel but suffered fuel starvation in tight turns.

My intial thinking was to dig up this old posting and redo the fuel module. But I remembered something from my racing days, and decided to add foam to the tank instead. Foam is sold in bricks, sections about 16x4x2 inches, and can be purchased from Jegs, Summit, or other performance parts supplier. I bought four foam bricks, and packed them in around the module. Viola! no more starvation problems in tight turns.

Also, keep in mind that if you pack the tank full of foam, it will stop the tank from bursting and spewing fuel. The tank will still leak after an accident rupture but will not burst fuel. The use of foam will protect the tank enough so that it becauses plausible to remove the heavy tank guard and save some weight, in addition to providing a cost effective prevention to fuel starvation problems.

And while great for a track car is probably useless on the street because the float that tells us how much fuel is in the tank is now unable to move due to foam bricks being in the way.

Dern IT.

[Ret NYCPD]

TTT

Few Years back completed the 8.1L...... Thanks ddawson!

Can this be upgraded to a Full Return System, and if so, what would be necessary to do it?

[b727pic]

Few Years back completed the 8.1L...... Thanks ddawson!

Can this be upgraded to a Full Return System, and if so, what would be necessary to do it?


Been there..................Done that!

this drawing has not been updated yet. The return line that was coiled to the top of the tank has been rerouted to connect to the venturi feed of the 8.1L bucket.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y183/conibell/Fue l%20System/GTOnewfuelsystem.jpg

Fuel returns into OEM Venturi feed. Although the wall thickness is pretty thin, I carefully tapped for the fitting shown. so far it has been working great.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y183/conibell/Fue l%20System/DSCF0121.jpg

[rednari]

Nesikachad you are supposed to leave the pick up free to operate when you pack in the foam. Jeees !!

[1SlowHoe]

This is it? It lists 3 different part numbers.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-FUEL-PUMP-04-07-GMC-SIERRA-MU1417-MU1314-MU1312_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1638Q2em118Q2el1 247QQcategoryZ33555QQihZ008QQitemZ180263372567QQrd Z1QQsspagenameZWD1V

[ddawson]

Yes that is correct.

[bravoboost]

so how low is low fuel .... having owned boosted cars in the past, ive never been in the habbit of running my fuel below 1/4 tank .... would it be cheaper just to stay above a 1/4 tank ?

[ddawson]

I try not too but I've been warned a few times that it's time to fill up.

I think 3 gallons are left when the warning chime goes off.

[1SlowHoe]

I did this upgrade a few days ago. Everything went fine and the car runs great. Today on the way home I get "Fuel Pump Sensor Malfunction, Contact Dealer" the chimes go off, the fuel gauge drops to empty and then 3 seconds later the chimes stop, the gauge reads normal, and the warning goes away. Any ideas?

[1SlowHoe]

Long Post
Update:
Today the car was still intermittently giving me hell about the fuel gauge malfunction. Well, I go to make a moderate 3rd gear on ramp merge and the car stuttered BAD. I got out of it, no KR registered on the Aeroforce gauge, and continued up the ramp. Check the fuel "distance to empty" on the dash and it reads 50 miles. Not sure if that and the fuel sensor work on different inputs but the gauge still read "E". I drive another 2 miles or so and again it stumbles just at a normal cruise. I slowly speed her up to about 65 and push in the clutch. Coast down the road and into a gas station. The car literally dies 10 feet from the pump and I roll right up to it and put on the e-brake.:popcorn2:

I put 9 gallons ($40:bomb:) in to see if the gauge was really jacked up. I also didn't want to fill it up in case I was going to end up pulling the tank tonight. It seems to be fine now. Though it reads a little over half a tank with the 9 gallons I put in. I guess thats about right if the tank was dead empty. I'm guessing that the gauge reads a little different with the 8.1L bucket? So before it triggers the low fuel light on the dash it seems to trigger the malfunction warning in the message center. Maybe I have the float orientated wrong in the tank though I don't see how that could be.
This is a pump that Dawson built for another member and I bought it, still new so I'm pretty sure it was put together correctly.

Any ideas?

[batboy]

Ok, I'm taking the plunge and attempting this mod. Never worked on an in-tank fuel pump system before, so this is a new experience. Is it fair to say that it's time consuming, but not hard?

Do you have to remove the whole gas tank or just loosen it, remove the filler tube, and tip it forward to pull out the assembly? If you have to remove the tank, how do you drain it?

I was pleasantly surprised to find prices were less than originally posted. The Silverado 8.1L bucket was $135 from Global-Automotive, the parts from APE were about $8, and the Magnacharger Hummer pump kit was $130. Total is about $300 if you include shipping.

[Gforce1320]

Ok, I'm taking the plunge and attempting this mod. Never worked on an in-tank fuel pump system before, so this is a new experience. Is it fair to say that it's time consuming, but not hard?

Do you have to remove the whole gas tank or just loosen it, remove the filler tube, and tip it forward to pull out the assembly? If you have to remove the tank, how do you drain it?

I was pleasantly surprised to find prices were less than originally posted. The Silverado 8.1L bucket was $135 from Global-Automotive, the parts from APE were about $8, and the Magnacharger Hummer pump kit was $130. Total is about $300 if you include shipping.

Stop the press, a PM is coming your way.

[BBGTO]

I'm looking to do this mod this coming week. Ordering up the bucket this weekend and parts needed from APE (ordering 2 of the plastic flex hoses, the 'thin' pump sleeve, the walbro connector, and 2 feet of the J30R10 5/16 high press. hose). One thing though, I already ordered the LPE pump kit. Can I get the barbed fitting that I need to do the bucket mod from the hardware store??? If so, what size is it? And are there any other parts that I'll need to get? THANKS!!

[BBGTO]

Per the Magnacharger kit...
The Magnacharger part number is #31-12-00-026 for the H2 Hummer.
This included the;
1 Fuel Pump, In-tank, Walbro GSS340
1 Fuel Pump Inlet Screen
1 Fuel Pump Sleeve
2 16-14ga. Push On Term Female
1 Fuel Pump Discharge Hose
1 Fitting, Fuel, In-tank Pump


I think I have everything else I'll need on order from APE (2 clear plastic flex hoses, 2 ft. of high press hose, 1 thin pump sleeve, and the walbro connector w/ butt splices). I'm just wondering about that "fitting" in bold. It'll be the BRASS fitting that comes in the magnacharger kit. ANYONE know where I can get this fitting?? And if there is anything else I'll need to do this? I just ordered up the bucket from global as well. THANKS!!!

[BBGTO]

Finished my install and now I have NO FUEL LEVEL INDICATION :( Still reads the same as when I took the tank out (VERY LOW FUEL and it's blinking and beeping at me). Problem with that is I put in 5 gallons before I started the car after the install was done :( Only thing I can think is that the wires are backwards at the 8.1L bucket to gto top half. But I did left to left, and right to right. Just as ddawson stated. OR the float is stuck? and won't raise?? I used the 8.1L bucket from Global Automotive on ebay. Can anyone help me out here? Can the wires be swapped somewhere other than IN THE TANK or do I need to pull the tank out again?

Also, I installed a KB boost a pump along with the new pump/bucket. I put in a chinzy ebay FP gauge off the rail too and am seeing like 56psi. I'm hoping that it's just the cheap gauge being off! Guess we'll see. I have the KB set to 30. And I installed it just like 727 did.

My boost gauge and wideband seem to be working (just installed them as well). Bout 15in/hg vac at idle and 14.3-15.0 fluctuation on the wideband at idle.

[b727pic]

Finished my install and now I have NO FUEL LEVEL INDICATION :( Still reads the same as when I took the tank out (VERY LOW FUEL and it's blinking and beeping at me). Problem with that is I put in 5 gallons before I started the car after the install was done :( Only thing I can think is that the wires are backwards at the 8.1L bucket to gto top half. But I did left to left, and right to right. Just as ddawson stated. OR the float is stuck? and won't raise?? I used the 8.1L bucket from Global Automotive on ebay. Can anyone help me out here? Can the wires be swapped somewhere other than IN THE TANK or do I need to pull the tank out again?

Also, I installed a KB boost a pump along with the new pump/bucket. I put in a chinzy ebay FP gauge off the rail too and am seeing like 56psi. I'm hoping that it's just the cheap gauge being off! Guess we'll see. I have the KB set to 30. And I installed it just like 727 did.

My boost gauge and wideband seem to be working (just installed them as well). Bout 15in/hg vac at idle and 14.3-15.0 fluctuation on the wideband at idle.

I have been fighting fuel qty issues ever since this mod. I finally have it reading 7/8ths when full, need one more tweak then I will have it.

Sounds to be as if you have no choice other than to pull the tank .....again. check the connections. as an alternative, assuming you have good ventilation in your work area:) pop the top off the tank, run a coat hanger or such to your float and see if its free, and does the gage react to the movement.....

[BBGTO]

How are you "adjusting" your level reading to be more correct? Also, has anyone heard of the float arm "hanging up" in the tank? It looked just like ddawson's finished pic (below) before I put it in. Now, IF the wires ARE backwards at the float sensor is this the outcome (no reading)?

Also, if ANYONE on here has some input/tips please please feel free to give me a call. I'm gonna be working on it starting in about 30 minutes and all through the day if I have to. THANKS

-Matt

912-655-0011

http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp12.jpg

[BBGTO]

Just found this on JoeCiv's install write-up...float wires hooked up opposite of ddawson's. What the hell??

http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/attachment.php?attach mentid=35942&stc=1&d=1148519380

[BBGTO]

Well, I pulled everything out/apart again and rewired it like JoeCiv's write-up. And then put the tank back in, hooked everything up, yada, yada.....and it works now. Thank god. Still seeing like 56ish psi on the new "ebay" mechanical FP gauge I installed off the rail. I was seeing 62-64psi at idle on the old pump, but was dropping to 50psi or a bit under by the end of the dyno run. Ah well. Guess we'll see. I have the KB set at 30 right now. Going in to Carter and getting back on the dyno today.

[ddawson]

I've seen several people after doing this state the Fuel Level didn't work. Many took the unit out and reinstalled which fixed the problem with no changes.

I highly suggest an OHM Meter to verify the sending unit is within specs before reinstalling everything.

[gotohmy]

I've seen several people after doing this state the Fuel Level didn't work. Many took the unit out and reinstalled which fixed the problem with no changes.

I highly suggest an OHM Meter to verify the sending unit is within specs before reinstalling everything.

Do you have the specs?

[ddawson]

Someone posted them from the Helm manual at one point.

I recall about 240 empty and 40 full.

[BBGTO]

Well, it works, but the fuel gauge is way the F off! Ugh! Put like 13 gallons of gas in the car and it only put me between 3/4 and a half tank. Plus, after filling up, it took the needle like 10 minutes (no kidding) to even climb to that mark!! What the hell??

[b727pic]

How are you "adjusting" your level reading to be more correct? ]

Some how (dont ask) my OEM float :bomb: :turbonaug , so I wound up trying to manipulate the 8.1L float. its been just alot of trial and error, cutting, bending, tweaking....etc. I am just about there, one more bend and it will be perfect.......just such a Pain gaining access:)

[BBGTO]

Some how (dont ask) my OEM float :bomb: :turbonaug , so I wound up trying to manipulate the 8.1L float. its been just alot of trial and error, cutting, bending, tweaking....etc. I am just about there, one more bend and it will be perfect.......just such a Pain gaining access:)

Can you post up or PM me the results once you get the float to read correctly?? PLEASE. :) I would like to know what needs to be done to manipulate the 8.1L float to read right!

[BBGTO]

Anyone ever throw a P0446 code after doing this mod? I threw it about 2 weeks ago. Cleared it. Threw it again today. Anyone?

P0446: EVAP purge/vent solenoid circuit condition

From the service manual:

"A restricted or blocked evaporative emission vent path is detected by the control module commanding the purge valve ON (open) and the vent valve ON (closed) allowing a vacuum to be applied to the EVAP system. Once a calibrated vacuum level has been reached, the control module commands the purge valve OFF (closed) and the vent valve OFF (open) while monitoring the fuel tank pressure (FTP) sensor for a decrease in vacuum. If the vacuum does not decrease to near 0 inches H2O in a calibrated time, DTC P0446 will set."

[nsurge]

Anyone, or vendor, selling this bucket upgrade as a kit, or pre-built so its plug and play? I was really looking forward to doing this, but it sounds like a hell of an undertaking with a lot of snags to deal with!

[CarlC]

Resurrecting a great thread....

I need some dimensions of the 8.1 bucket:

1) Height of the bucket only.
2) The largest diameter on the bucket NOT including the fuel level sensor.

I may try to retrofit this unit into another tank but using LS1/Magnacharged drivetrain.

Thanks a bunch.

[marcevo1]

i have a full kit wired up / assembeled etc minus a walbro if anyones interested? make me an offer? - i'm over in UK but postage is no problem

Marc

[ddawson]

Another year bump with no issues.

[Ret NYCPD]

My 8.1L has worked fine since installed approx. 3 years ago

Is it possible to turn this into a Full Return dual pump system, and if so, what parts would I need?

Thanks!

[BBGTO]

Well, I've had it in for about 4 months now. Up until Saturday I've not had one fuel related issue. Saturday as I was pulling into the driveway my check engine light came on and my fuel gauge dropped to E. Also got a Service Engine Soon/Contact Dealer thing on the display. It does it every time now when I turn the car to ON (but don't start it). So annoying. Just started out of nowhere. Anyone had this issue? I've searched and it seems to be a common problem, but I'm trying to find out the FIX for it.


Oh, and the level issue (not reading all the way to full) is not really an issue now. It does'nt go to full as quickly as it did w/ the stock bucket, but it's sped up some and it reads almost right at the F now when filled all the way up.

[2QWK4RU 06 GOAT]

anyone seal the bottom holes of the bucket?

[scot254]

anyone seal the bottom holes of the bucket?

I haven't looked at mine in a while, isn't that how fuel enters the bucket?

[b727pic]

anyone seal the bottom holes of the bucket?

The holes are there for a reason, sealing them off will make keeping the bucket full of fuel more difficult, not easier.:)

[GTO1_OHIO]

Don't really see a need for the bigger bucket. I upgraded my fuel pump last year and haven't had any problems in just under 100 runs at the track. ...did have a problem with the one in my 2008 Silverado through. lol

[kjhallex]

I plan on installing a d1 procharger kit and running around 6 or 7psi (untill I get more $$$) do you think that the just the walbro 255 from epp. Is it going to give me enough fuel to be safe?
Thanks Kyle

[BBGTO]

Kyle, it'll work. The problem is burning up pumps and not being able to keep the stock bucket full w/ fuel under load. I believe that that's probably why my first pump only lasted about a yr. If I were you I'd just do it all at once (8.1 w/ the 255). It's not that much more money (just the cost of the bucket and the plastic hoses, etc). And I can help you do it. Trust me, I've had my tank in and out 3 times!!! I know how to do it at this point :)

Here's the part you need to order Kyle. C'mon. Just $135 buck more! Said and done, prob. $150 more than what you'd be spending w/o doing the bucket.

8.1 L BUCKET (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-FUEL-PUMP-04-07-SILVERADO-MU1417-MU1314-MU1312_W0QQitemZ390033202636QQihZ026QQcategoryZ335 55QQssPageNameZWD1VQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp 1638Q2em118Q2el1247)

[kjhallex]

I agree If i go that route I wouldnt have to worrie aboud it. So all I need is that pump from ebay, a 255? Where did you get the plastic lines from? Thanks for your help Matt!

[bondosgto]

this needs to be sticky in the new fuel section

[slyb28]

Drilling holes in the bucket sides and bottom???????????? Doesn't that defeat the purpose of the 8.1 L bucket upgrade to begin with? Isn't the purpose of the 8.1L bucket to hold a larger volume of fuel around the pump (due to filling of bucket with the eductor/venturi port from the returned fuel) to prevent fuel starvation (lean condition) and to offer cooling to the pump? The drilled holes defeat both of these benefits in my opinion. Sounds like someone with the "drilled bucket" mod had better keep their tank full as much as possible.

Am I missing something here? Drilling holes sounds like a bad idea.
were did you obtain the replacement fuel line

[mrmatt]

Does this bucket:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-FUEL-PUMP-04-07-SILVERADO-MU1417-MU1314-MU1312_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3911Q2ec0Q2em14Q QhashZitem5882ae444cQQitemZ380149580876QQptZMotors Q5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

Include the correct sensor or with that would I still need to order - GM#88965379 (per the first post)?

I'm looking at upgrading the fuel system this winter and if I'm going to mess with the pump I may as well try doing the bucket at the same time.

[ddawson]

I should come with the correct float.

[jon6.0]

How much hp will this support on a turbo motor?

[sergo]

subscribed for future reference...

[rob v]

ddawson, need your help, i have a stock fuel system, i read somewhere that you can drill holes around the bucket in pre determined spots, that will let the pump get more volume, anything to this. thanks, rob v

[Flash99]

I remember reading about this ages ago. Great write up and great addition to the fuel section. One of the mods I plan on doing shortly. Thumbs up!

[b727pic]

ddawson, need your help, i have a stock fuel system, i read somewhere that you can drill holes around the bucket in pre determined spots, that will let the pump get more volume, anything to this. thanks, rob v

The whole purpose behind a semi sealed bucket with a venturi feed system is to keep the fuel pump submerged when the fuel tank level is low. while drilling holes in the bucket will help higher HP applications keep up with fuel demand, this approach negates keeping the bucket full with low tank levels.....ie easy in = easy out. You could make this work, I just wouldn't romp on it hard with less than a quarter tank of fuel.

There is no easy cheap solution to fueling our GTO's. the 8.1L bucket mod is just about as cheap as it gets, but still a PIA to accomplish. Get the parts as Dan has outlined, and plan on a nice Saturday to get it all installed.

FYI, if you plan on an FI boost reference setup, this is only the beginning:)

[Gregmcneely]

Some tips for converting the GTO Fuel Bucket to the 8.1L Bucket.

Parts,
8.1L GM Part Number GM#88965372 or AC Delco PN MU1312
Revised Part Numbers GM # 19133455 or AC DELCO PN MU1417
Float Sensor unit part number is GM#88965379

http://www.magnacharger.com
The Magnacharger part number is #31-12-00-026 for the H2 Hummer.
This included the;
1 Fuel Pump, In-tank, Walbro GSS340
1 Fuel Pump Inlet Screen
1 Fuel Pump Sleeve
2 16-14ga. Push On Term Female
1 Fuel Pump Discharge Hose
1 Fitting, Fuel, In-tank Pump

http://www.autoperformanceengineering.com/
APE Flexible Plastic Hose
You may also want to the get the APE Connector instead of the Magnacharger Push on Terminals.
Walbro Connector with Butt Connectors.


You will also need two small hose clamps for the above line and 1 large hose clamp for the Fuel Neck and a box of Heat Shrink Butt Connectors.

UPDATE
A seller on Ebay "ID is global-automotive" sells a complete bucket that INCLUDES the correct Float Sensor.

Also if your careful you can use the 8.1L buckets flex line and attache the GTO connector to the end of the flex line so you only have 1 worm clamp.
Thanks to those who keep finding out more information on this setup.

Picture of Finished Bucket.
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp12.jpg

Removing the tank,
http://www.lingenfelter.com/documents/gtofuelpumpu pgrade.pdf

Over View,
Remove the fuel tank and pull the GTO Bucket.
Unclip the two Connectors from the top of the bucket
Remove the C Clip from the rod and separate the upper and lower section.
You will use the Upper half on the 8.1L Bucket so place it somewhere safe.

Modify the 8.1L Bucket.
See http://magnacharger.com/pdf/manual-HummerH2.pdf
Steps 20 though 42
The only difference is you will NOT be keeping the upper half.
Don't attach the bottom cover just yet.

Now you want to use the GTO Connectors and Butt Connect them to the 8.1L wires.
Take care that you get positive and negative correct on the Fuel pump.
If you use the Magnacharger kit you will use the spade connectors on the GTO wiring.

For the Float sensor wiring,
Place both Sensors in front of you. The new one points right and the GTO one points left.
Using the GTO connector Butt connect the left wire to the left wire of the new Float Sensor.
You can verify the correct wiring by using an OHM Meter. Empty is the higher number while full is a lower number.

Now you can connect the GTO Upper half to the 8.1L lower have. Slide the rods into the bucket and use the C Clip to hold it together. Attach the 8.1L bottom to the Bucket now. To line it up correctly the GTO upper half will be at the 3 O'clock position and the Float Arm will point to the 2 O'clock position.
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp10.jpg
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp11.jpg

This was the hardest part at the time but I found a better solution.
Making the fuel line that attaches to the tank,

Use a razorblade knife and cut the tubing off the connector that attaches to the fuel tank. Do the same thing for the 8.1L 90 Degree Connector that comes off the Fuel filter.

On both Connectors sand the barbs down enough to you can get a good fit with the APR Flex Line then use a hose clamp on both connectors.

http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp16.jpg
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp17.jpg
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp15.jpg

Snap the 90 Degree Connector back into the Fuel Filter.
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp19.jpg
http://ddawson1.net/images/GTO/fp18.jpg

You're done and it's time to reassembly.

Thanks to PO04GTO and b727pic for helping me out.

I drove around town with the "You Need Fuel Stupid" flashing at me and had no problems.

I hope this help. Any questions??

In your estimation this would support how much horsepower

[paul abajian]

It allows you to run low on fuel without staving the fuel pump.

The GTO bucket doesn’t allow enough fuel into the bucket with a high flow pump. The pump will suck the bucket dry leaving the pump with no fuel and no cooling.

People have added holes to the bottom of the GTO bucket which fixes the supply issue but as the tank runs low the holes allow the fuel to drain out of the bucket again leaving the pump with no fuel. This is turn burns out the pump.

You can see in the last picture if you look closely that there is fuel in the bucket sitting on my driveway. No fuel is leaking out.

The 8.1L bucket allows enough fuel to enter the bucket without modification and also doesn’t allow the fuel to drain out when the fuel tank gets low.

At this point we know it can supply 500HP which is fine for me but I don’t think we know were the 8.1L bucket becomes a limiting factor again.
The bucket on the stock set-up rests on the bottom of the fuel tank, so you dont have a problem with fuel running out of the bucket unless you are in the habit of running your fuel down to almost empty. I installed the Ligenfelter fuel pump system which puts out a max of 300lph @ 16 Volts and only removed the old stock pump and drilled 3 holes in the stock bucket about 3/4 inches off the botton. With the bucket resting on the bottom of the tank, those holes will not flow fuel out unless the fuel tank is almost dry. I usually fill up @ 1/4 to 1/8 fuel remaining and I've had NO problems. Pump was $139. plus shipping and VERY EASY to install. Hardest part of the job was dropping the old tank. I wanted the 8.1 L bucket setup but this works as well and was a lot less expensive with NO PROBLEMS EITHER RACING OR CRUISING. I just have to keep the fuel level above about 1/8 tank. With all the hp I put down, I needed 79lb injectors and the stock pump would not feed them properly so I was forced to upgrade.

[seala8]

so i just ordered teh 8.1L bucket from ebay and the LPE walbro 255 pump from speed inc. What else do i need? Any chance of gettin them locally?

[Wynoe]

I did this mod and it was pretty straight forward. I have had no problem and have run my tank down to 1/8 to see if the level sensor reads correctly and it does. I also had read that some people's fuel level needle moved up slowly after a fill up, but mine is no different from stock. Had the tank in and out in less than two hours (first time removing tank). I did the 8.1 mod before the tank removal. I purchased a stock fuel setup from ebay so that I could save my stock one just in case I screwed something up.

[05gto60]

i finally ordered all the stuff to do this mod. I have a spare walbro pump in hand already, so i just ordered the bucket from ebay, and all the little parts from APE, hopefully ill have everything a couple days into december

[Nomorefbodys]

OK I am going to do this also as I'm 472 wheel on the stock pump NA adding the spray so I already had a LPE pump kit so I just bought the sending unit referenced in post #151 Am I correct in thinking I can rig this to work with no other parts ?? appears thats correct I see post of people buying hose somewhere and others saying you can make the 8.1 units hose work .. Guess I will know better when its in my hands next week. I figure I can't sell the car so might as well see if we can put 650 rwhp down and go have some fun !!!

[05gto60]

has anyone else had a problem with the gauge not reading right after filling up? when i put the bucket in it read about 1/2 tank, which i think was right, and went down from there. when i filled it up it went back to that 1/2 mark, and then after driving for a little while it eventually made it to full and went down like normal from there.

i filled up again yesterday and it did the same thing. i went to 1/2, and then after driving it slowly went to full. anyone know whats going on???

[2QWK4RU 06 GOAT]

welcome to the club, at least yours reads...

[05gto60]

it reads, but it also reads correctly. it just takes between 5-10min to get there after filling up. ive got the battery disconnected again but it has a full tank right now, so ill see what comes of it the next time i fill up.

[ddawson]

Could be a bad sensor or float.

[Owe5Goat]

I have a full GTO assembly in my basement in a box. If anyone needs it for parts send me a PM. I want to get rid of the whole thing.

[05gto60]

Could be a bad sensor or float.

thing is, it reads correct but its just slow to get there and only after filling up. once it reaches full it will read correctly after that.

[CarlC]

Does anyone have an 8.1L bucket on the bench? I could really use these dim's.

Resurrecting a great thread....

I need some dimensions of the 8.1 bucket:

1) Height of the bucket only.
2) The largest diameter on the bucket NOT including the fuel level sensor.

I may try to retrofit this unit into another tank but using an LS1/ GTO Magnacharged drivetrain.

Thanks a bunch.

[GOATMAN 51]

Does anyone have an 8.1L bucket on the bench? I could really use these dim's.

I have one coming this week, when it arrives I will get the dimensions for you.

[ArthurJGuy]

Does anyone have an 8.1L bucket on the bench? I could really use these dim's.

I have one in the garage that I will be installing tomorrow.

[gtomiami]

Hello GTO people, I did this mod back in March of '06, when this thread was started. I got the bucket off ebay and, and the pump from Lingfelder.
I am running 62lb injectors, maf-less speed density tune, GT67turbo and made 525 rwhp on the dyno, with my tuner's help (Jeremy Formato).

The fuel gauge works perfectly, and I have had no problems after nearly 4 years.

As I remember, I think that I had to remove the whole damn tank, right after putting things together the first time. Something got hung up, and the gauge didn't work. But, I took it apart and reassembled it, and it worked right the second time.

I am still running low boost, so I have a long ways to go, tuning wise. I see about 9lbs on the boost gauge, and so I bought some heavier springs for the wastegate. I haven't installed them yet. Looking to run the boost up to about 15 or 20 lbs. (its got forged internals). I took a break from all the modifying, and just drive the car.

This is a really good mod . Good luck .

[EdHenderson]

Does anyone have an 8.1L bucket on the bench? I could really use these dim's.

1) Height of the bucket only.

The molded D-shaped bucket is 6.750" tall- if you include the raised section for the sending unit mount, it's 7.235" tall overall.

2) The largest diameter on the bucket NOT including the fuel level sensor.

Mine measures 5.040" at the top (with inner piece in place), tapering to 4.950" at the bottom

[CarlC]

Thank you very much Ed.

If you have the flange OD of the upper section that would also be helpful. Someone told me it too was 5" but that makes no sense given your dim's.

Thank again, you're saving me from having to buy one and then find out it won't fit.

[EdHenderson]

I've got the garage buttoned up for the evening, Carl, but will pull that info for you tomorrow AM.

.

[CarlC]

Much gras Ed.

[EdHenderson]

The round metal section of the top- the portion which fits down into the tank- mikes 5.100" Ø (well- more precisely, 5.098").

The round sealing flange measures 5.990" in diameter.

Drop me a PM, or email if you need other dimensions... happy to assist if I can.

.

[CarlC]

Thank again Ed. That's what I needed. I owe you a beer.