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Old 11-15-2012, 12:11 PM   #1
MDbrazengoat
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My Bassani takes a dump!

Okay folks, looking for help here...

I bought a Bassani exhaust from Maryland Speed a few years ago, along with Kooks SS headers and Catted 3" mid pipes for my 2006 GTO. I've since added a good bit of HP over stock (over 500 RWHP), and I think this may have overwhelmed the Bassani system. A few weeks ago, I heard a loud backfire directly under my seat (where the Bassani x-pipe muffler sits). Definite exhaust leak from that location afterwards. On the lift, you can see that the muffler casing has split open down the seam. Bassani offers a lifetime warranty on their systems, but do you think they will honor that given all of my other upgrades? I'm running a Procharger at 6psi, plus a cam and 60lb injectors. I may need to move to a 3 inch system like the Kooks or Spintech, but I don't want to spend the money if I don't have to.

I'm really wondering why the Bassani muffler split open like that. I believe that so much fuel was going through the system, that it made it's way down there and detonated. BEHE tuned my car and put the cam and injectors in. They claimed that the previous tune was way too lean, but I never had an issue with it in over 2 years of hard running. Since I'm no expert, I went with what they said as truth, but now I have to say that I'm not too sure. I'm not real happy with them in general. They took some shortcuts on things, and did some work half-assed, hoping I wouldn't notice, so the trust is gone.

I'm wondering if the tune is now way too rich? Since I've added the cam and 60lb injectors, I always smell gas in the cabin and all around the car at idle. At WOT the smell is almost overpowering. Now with the exhaust leak on top of that, it smells like someone doused the whole car in gasoline every time I step on the go pedal!

I'm going to need to repair or replace the exhaust in any case, but I would hate to do that only to have this type of detonation again. I hear good things about Andrew at CSP in PA. He was originally my fist choice during the last round of mods, but since he doesn't do suspension work, I went with BEHE since they were also a Pedders installer. I'm thinking of getting in touch with him, to see if he'd be a good choice to do the exhaust repair/replace, and more importantly, check out my tune.

Any thoughts from the great and the wise out here would be appreciated!
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Old 11-15-2012, 12:58 PM   #2
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Call Bassani I think you will be surprised
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Old 11-15-2012, 01:14 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MDbrazengoat...View Post
.......I'm wondering if the tune is now way too rich? Since I've added the cam and 60lb injectors, I always smell gas in the cabin and all around the car at idle. At WOT the smell is almost overpowering. Now with the exhaust leak on top of that, it smells like someone doused the whole car in gasoline every time I step on the go pedal!

Are you saying you went with bigger injectors after the tune? .....or were they in there for the tune? You definitely shouldn't be smelling fuel and need to stop wondering and get it checked out.
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Old 11-15-2012, 01:45 PM   #4
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You added a cam and changed injectors without a tune?
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Old 11-15-2012, 01:48 PM   #5
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I don't think that it'd be possible to get enough gasoline down into the pipes to cause an explosion that would split the exhaust, without noticing some severe issues with the car. If you're in MD you need to talk to Rick Kim at RKT56, or come to Delaware and see Fran at Race Proven Motorsports.
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Old 11-15-2012, 02:06 PM   #6
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I'm running your exact exhaust setup on my 2006 (Kooks stepped, catted mids, Bassani). Granted I'm only 505RWHP (TVS1900), but I've not experienced any exhaust problems. I have a little backfire on decel, but no gas smell ever. FWIW.
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Old 11-15-2012, 02:33 PM   #7
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If you went to bigger injectors without the proper tuning (thats the way you made it sound) you blew it up with extra fuel and you will probably blow other stuff up too, like all the oxygen sensors, foul out everything in the combustion chamber, etc.
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Old 11-15-2012, 04:12 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2step...View Post
Are you saying you went with bigger injectors after the tune? .....or were they in there for the tune? You definitely shouldn't be smelling fuel and need to stop wondering and get it checked out.

Sequence of events: 4 years ago put on Kooks and Bassani + tune. 2 years ago put on the Procharger + tune. End of last year added the cam, spring kit and lifters + tune (conservative tune because of 43# injectors). Beginning of this year switched the 43's for 60's and had the car tuned. Started smelling gas as soon as the cam went in. It got really bad after the 60's went in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oh4GTO...View Post
You added a cam and changed injectors without a tune?

See above.

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Originally Posted by dizzysn...View Post
I don't think that it'd be possible to get enough gasoline down into the pipes to cause an explosion that would split the exhaust, without noticing some severe issues with the car. If you're in MD you need to talk to Rick Kim at RKT56, or come to Delaware and see Fran at Race Proven Motorsports.

I wouldn't think so either, but now I'm not sure. BEHE cut corners as I said, and they even left a few hangers off the exhaust after I got the car back. Could it be possible that the center section was loose enough to let some air in and cause a detonation? No issues with the car at all except the gas smell, loud exhaust, and a complete lack of traction. Car runs very strong.

Where is Rick Kim? Haven't heard about RKT56.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Third_Goat...View Post
I'm running your exact exhaust setup on my 2006 (Kooks stepped, catted mids, Bassani). Granted I'm only 505RWHP (TVS1900), but I've not experienced any exhaust problems. I have a little backfire on decel, but no gas smell ever. FWIW.

Did you upgrade the cam and injectors?

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Originally Posted by Steel Chicken...View Post
If you went to bigger injectors without the proper tuning (thats the way you made it sound) you blew it up with extra fuel and you will probably blow other stuff up too, like all the oxygen sensors, foul out everything in the combustion chamber, etc.

Like I said, I got tuned at each step of modification. I just don't think I trust the tune. The smell of gas is so strong now that I think it must be running way rich. I did check the plugs recently to see if any of them were fouled, but they were all good. I think I need a second opinion (tune-wise) for my Goat.

Last edited by MDbrazengoat; 11-15-2012 at 04:30 PM.
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Old 11-15-2012, 04:20 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by bohnman...View Post
Call Bassani I think you will be surprised

Think I will to see if they'd be willing to replace that section of the exhaust. I really like the Bassani sound, but if they want big $$, I might as well just upgrade to the Kooks 3" setup. The Kooks and Spin Tech systems both offer 3" diameter all the way, plus a true x-pipe that would replace the Bassani perforated muffler x-type and 2.5" diameter.

In any case, I think I need the tune checked along with other things on the car before I commit to a new exhaust.

Last edited by MDbrazengoat; 11-15-2012 at 04:32 PM.
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Old 11-15-2012, 04:50 PM   #10
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I'd like to see what this split muffler looks like...got any pics? If your car smells like gas, it's probably a danger to drive...I certainly hope you get this fixed.
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Old 11-15-2012, 05:17 PM   #11
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Have you checked around the injectors for a fuel leak. That should have been the first thing you should have done.
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Old 11-15-2012, 05:38 PM   #12
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I'd like to see what this split muffler looks like...got any pics? If your car smells like gas, it's probably a danger to drive...I certainly hope you get this fixed.

Smelling gas after a cam install is not that unusual. I've looked through the forum and many others have said the same thing. However, the strength of the smell in addition to the leaking exhaust is a whole new dimension in stinky, and yeah I need to get this looked at pronto. That's why I'm out here.

I had it up on a lift at the body shop (some ditz from NY t-boned me last month, but that's a whole 'nother story). The tech took some pics and I'm waiting for him to send them to me. I'll post them as soon as I get them.
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Old 11-15-2012, 05:42 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Oh4GTO...View Post
Have you checked around the injectors for a fuel leak. That should have been the first thing you should have done.

When it started smelling really strong, I did check initially, but they were dry. Checked the plugs too, but they were clean. I haven't checked after a WOT run though. Gonna do that, but I'm nervous about pushing her in her current condition.
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Old 11-15-2012, 05:44 PM   #14
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Make sure you check with the car running. Otherwise is may evaporate too fast. Its also possible that you have an injector stuck open. How does the car start?
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Old 11-15-2012, 07:10 PM   #15
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Make sure you check with the car running. Otherwise is may evaporate too fast. Its also possible that you have an injector stuck open. How does the car start?

Had a neighbor check it while I was revving the engine, but that was moths ago (last spring), but it was okay then. Like I said, the car runs strong, and it turns over quite easy, even when dead cold.
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Old 11-16-2012, 03:33 AM   #16
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Call Bassani and CSP. I wouldn't do a whole lot of driving until this gets sorted out.
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Old 11-16-2012, 04:31 AM   #17
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Unless the gasoline smell actually got worse when you swapped injectors (not psychosomatic), I wouldn't think much of it. I'm assuming you're catless... big overlap cams will push unburnt fuel straight out the exhaust. My garage smells like straight gasoline if I idle in it for more than a minute.

I can't imagine that any combustion event taking place in the exhaust would be enough to rip a muffler open. I can shoot flames out my tail pipes with a 2 step- literally dumping several cylinders' worth of fuel into the exhaust with every revolution of the crank, at 3200 rpm, and it ignites in the exhaust and does the whole burst of flames and a gunshot crack thing, and all it ever does is make people laugh. The sheer volume of gas flowing through the exhaust pushes the whole thing out the exit of the exhaust- maybe you've got a clogged muffler? Any change in sound before the event, maybe you lost a baffle or something?

Or, dare I ask, did you hit something on the road to rip it open?
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Old 11-16-2012, 04:44 AM   #18
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If their customer service is 1/2 as good as Corsa, they should take care of you.

I had 2 corsa mufflers replaced on my 98 WS6, no questions asked, they paid shipping both ways, I just had to give a credit card for a deposit.

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Old 11-16-2012, 04:51 AM   #19
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Well, this is the 6th bad story I've heard about BEHE. I've heard three good ones, so I thank you for that. They charge an arm and a leg for everything, and apparently do good work for their regulars, but half ass for the newbies/one timers.

Sorry to hear about the muffler, I have nothing to add to that, Just wanted to thank you for the feed back.
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Old 11-16-2012, 05:51 AM   #20
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Hook up a couple of spark plugs in your exhaust tips and see if you can get some flames.
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Old 11-16-2012, 12:55 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 87LC2...View Post
Call Bassani and CSP. I wouldn't do a whole lot of driving until this gets sorted out.

I've already emailed Andrew at CSP, and am just waiting for his response. I'll call Bassani as soon as I have some decent pics of the muffler. The car seems okay to drive as long as I keep my right foot on Valium.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rauq...View Post
Unless the gasoline smell actually got worse when you swapped injectors (not psychosomatic), I wouldn't think much of it. I'm assuming you're catless... big overlap cams will push unburnt fuel straight out the exhaust. My garage smells like straight gasoline if I idle in it for more than a minute.

I can't imagine that any combustion event taking place in the exhaust would be enough to rip a muffler open. I can shoot flames out my tail pipes with a 2 step- literally dumping several cylinders' worth of fuel into the exhaust with every revolution of the crank, at 3200 rpm, and it ignites in the exhaust and does the whole burst of flames and a gunshot crack thing, and all it ever does is make people laugh. The sheer volume of gas flowing through the exhaust pushes the whole thing out the exit of the exhaust- maybe you've got a clogged muffler? Any change in sound before the event, maybe you lost a baffle or something?

Or, dare I ask, did you hit something on the road to rip it open?

No, the smell definitely seemed more present when I switched to the 60lb injectors. It was definitely there before, but the tune was more conservative because BEHE was concerned that I'd run out of fuel up top with the 43's. This is why I think this is more of a tuning issue. I did expect the smell to be there because of the cam, but this is way worse than it should be. With the exhaust leak it truly is overpowering. By the end of my 30 minute commute to work, I feel nauseous if I get on the gas hard. If I drive it sanely, then it's just barely tolerable. I am running catted mids (Kooks), so it should not smell this strongly. However, I suppose that a blockage could have occurred that may have caused the muffler to blow apart, but I wont really know until it's all apart.

I definitely did not hit anything. I was going for it though, and BANG! Pretty sure it happened between shifts.

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Originally Posted by slow...View Post
If their customer service is 1/2 as good as Corsa, they should take care of you.

I had 2 corsa mufflers replaced on my 98 WS6, no questions asked, they paid shipping both ways, I just had to give a credit card for a deposit.

Ryan

I hope so.

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Originally Posted by Tishkevich...View Post
Well, this is the 6th bad story I've heard about BEHE. I've heard three good ones, so I thank you for that. They charge an arm and a leg for everything, and apparently do good work for their regulars, but half ass for the newbies/one timers.

Sorry to hear about the muffler, I have nothing to add to that, Just wanted to thank you for the feed back.

I don't like to bad mouth anyone, but yeah, if you are on the fence about having them do work for you, I'd stay away. They did a lot of work for me, like my entire suspension upgrade, clutch and dirve-train upgrades, and most of the work seems pretty solid. However, the guy who did the majority of the work left the shop during my upgrades (citing darkly that he didn't like the way the business was run) and BEHE's son took over. That, I believe, is where the majority of the problems comes from. The guy is nice enough, but he's not careful, and misses things. Important things. And nobody is checking the work. No quality control. Yeah. Stay away.

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Hook up a couple of spark plugs in your exhaust tips and see if you can get some flames.

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Old 11-16-2012, 01:22 PM   #22
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In the old days, we would take a beater and get it going pretty good through a tunnel. Take your foot off the gas, shut off the engine, pump the gas a couple times and then turn the key back on.

People have blown mufflers right off the car.

With a carb, even on engine decel it would feed some gas, pump the pedal and the engine sucks up the fuel and dumps it right out the exhaust. Turn the key back on and you light the fire. All that raw fuel pumped into the exhaust lights off and you get a good backfire. Too much and it will blow the exhaust apart.


You had a little one of those.
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Old 11-16-2012, 03:43 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by 87LC2...View Post
In the old days, we would take a beater and get it going pretty good through a tunnel. Take your foot off the gas, shut off the engine, pump the gas a couple times and then turn the key back on.

People have blown mufflers right off the car.

With a carb, even on engine decel it would feed some gas, pump the pedal and the engine sucks up the fuel and dumps it right out the exhaust. Turn the key back on and you light the fire. All that raw fuel pumped into the exhaust lights off and you get a good backfire. Too much and it will blow the exhaust apart.


You had a little one of those.

I believe this to be the case as well. I just got a response from Andrew at CSP, and he feels, based on the description I gave, that this is a tuning issue, and that BEHE may have turned something off that they shouldn't have (like the front O2 sensors perhaps). I think that's right. I believe they also may have defeated the fuel cutoff when releasing throttle. Not 100% sure about this, but the car runs and backfires in such a way as it never did before. I'm not talking about the normal GTO popping that happens on decel. This is that, but with the added explosive effect you get when fuel is still being pumped out. When I'm hard on the gas, and then have to back off quick, it backfires way more than it used to. Like truckloads of gas is still pouring out when it should not be. This is also when the gas smell is at its worst.

Gonna get my car up to CSP just as soon as I can.
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Old 11-16-2012, 05:43 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by 87LC2...View Post
In the old days, we would take a beater and get it going pretty good through a tunnel. Take your foot off the gas, shut off the engine, pump the gas a couple times and then turn the key back on.

People have blown mufflers right off the car.

With a carb, even on engine decel it would feed some gas, pump the pedal and the engine sucks up the fuel and dumps it right out the exhaust. Turn the key back on and you light the fire. All that raw fuel pumped into the exhaust lights off and you get a good backfire. Too much and it will blow the exhaust apart.


You had a little one of those.

I did that on my dad's car. The mechanic knew what had happened. The fault of the OP's issue is in the car not the exhaust. If they warranty it I'd count my blessings as I think it was external to the Bassani system
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Old 11-16-2012, 05:55 PM   #25
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I did that on my dad's car. The mechanic knew what had happened. The fault of the OP's issue is in the car not the exhaust. If they warranty it I'd count my blessings as I think it was external to the Bassani system

I'd already concluded as much, but since I'm not sure of the facts yet, there's still room to hope that they'll cover it. If not, Kooks Screamer, here I come.
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Old 11-17-2012, 04:12 AM   #26
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If some idiot defeats DFCO in a misguided attempt to eliminate popping on deceleration, it can easily load up the exhaust with gas when the throttle is lifted in gear. All that fuel being sucked into the cylinders without burning also doesn't do your rings and cylinder walls any good, as it will wash away the oil film.
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Old 11-17-2012, 11:30 AM   #27
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interested in the pics, I have bassani exhaust and its built very solid, don't see how you could split muffler?
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Old 11-19-2012, 05:18 AM   #28
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If some idiot defeats DFCO in a misguided attempt to eliminate popping on deceleration, it can easily load up the exhaust with gas when the throttle is lifted in gear. All that fuel being sucked into the cylinders without burning also doesn't do your rings and cylinder walls any good, as it will wash away the oil film.

Not even sure what his reason would be for defeating DFCO, or if he did in fact defeat it, but it wouldn't surprise me. Yeah, gonna be driving like a grandma till I can get the whole car sorted.
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Old 11-19-2012, 05:26 AM   #29
MDbrazengoat
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2006 GTO Owner

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Location: Bowie, Maryland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdasterly...View Post
interested in the pics, I have bassani exhaust and its built very solid, don't see how you could split muffler?

I thought the body shop had taken pics of the muffler, but it turns out that it was the insurance company. I'm trying to get hold of the field agent that took the pictures, to see if he'd be willing to send them to me. Otherwise, I'll need to get the car up in the air enough for me to snap a few shots. I'll post as soon as I have them.

In any case, I don't think this failure has anything to do with Bassani build quality.
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Old 11-21-2012, 06:42 AM   #30
44CUPMASTER
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Have you gotten in touch with Behe? They've done work on my cars and stood behind their work each time. Call them and ask to make it right.

I've been down this road before (not with them) and my first inclination is to take it back to the source first. Let them try to fix it first before you spend time chasing down Bassani.
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