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Old 01-18-2013, 09:15 AM   #1
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Question Switching to water?

Hey guys,

Revisiting this question from my other thread, got a track day coming up in a few weeks and while I change out fluids, the thought popped up again about switching out my coolant in my stock radiator (Mustang) to just running water & Red Line Water Wetter.

I live in a climate that is basically always between 45-65 degrees. Track days in the summer do get hot though (95+). And I'm fairly certain I will never see below freezing temperatures with the car.

Here is what the back of the Water Wetter bottle says:
Quote:
Originally Posted by City Goat...View Post
- Testing showed 50/50 coolant was at 230 degrees
- 50/50 with Water Wetter was at 220
- Water only was 210
- Water & Water Wetter was 200


Really interested in your thoughts and practical experience with it. Thanks!

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Old 01-18-2013, 09:58 AM   #2
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Antifreeze is also a corrosion inhibitor. Your stock stuff won't last too long with regular pee water use, but for a track day, sure
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Old 01-18-2013, 10:21 AM   #3
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I ran water and ww in my camaro for about a year back before it started to get cold in Florida winters, no issues.

WW has rust and corrosion inhibitors in it.
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Old 01-18-2013, 11:10 AM   #4
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Re: Switching to water?

Coolant also has lubrication. Notice its slick as snot if you spill it on the floor.

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Old 01-18-2013, 11:12 AM   #5
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Water pump lube is basically soluble oil as used in machine tools. If you go straight water you might want to go up to 5% of your cooling system volume with water pump lube. It's milky white out of the can. Water wetter is great stuff, worked for me.
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Old 01-18-2013, 11:58 AM   #6
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We have about 7500 miles of racing using straight water and water-wetter in our race car ('92 240sx endurance racing with ChumpCar). Coolant is specifically not allowed due to difficulty of cleanup. No problems with cooling or with corrosion or water pump failures. YMMV.
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Old 01-18-2013, 02:45 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TObey...View Post
We have about 7500 miles of racing using straight water and water-wetter in our race car ('92 240sx endurance racing with ChumpCar). Coolant is specifically not allowed due to difficulty of cleanup. No problems with cooling or with corrosion or water pump failures. YMMV.

this
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Old 01-18-2013, 02:47 PM   #8
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Thanks for the info guys.

And I'm assuming distilled water?
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Old 01-18-2013, 02:56 PM   #9
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Have been using a WW/distilled water mix for years in our race engines,without one complaint. As stated above dex/antifreeze is not allowed due to obvious reasons. I can't comment on the freezing characteristics of it though,as everything is sucked out for the winter months.
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Old 01-18-2013, 04:04 PM   #10
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I use Amsoil Coolant Boost and for reasons I don't understand, the instructions explicitly say "use tap water, not distilled water".

I don't think I'd bother swapping out the coolant in your car unless you're having temperature issues. The main advantage of doing so is not killing people if you pop a hose, but everyone else out there will be running antifreeze...
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Old 01-18-2013, 04:11 PM   #11
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Re: Switching to water?

Just throwing this out there because I watched Wheeler Dealer last night. But they used this stuff that contains no water and takes the BP of water from 212* to 356* (they use *C, so Im pretty sure he said 180). He ran the car for awhile and took off the radiator cap with no issue or boiling.

Maybe this is the stuff you're talking about or this isn't new, so forgive my ignorance on the matter.
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Old 01-18-2013, 07:56 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacos from your dike landlords...View Post
Just throwing this out there because I watched Wheeler Dealer last night. But they used this stuff that contains no water and takes the BP of water from 212* to 356* (they use *C, so Im pretty sure he said 180). He ran the car for awhile and took off the radiator cap with no issue or boiling.

Maybe this is the stuff you're talking about or this isn't new, so forgive my ignorance on the matter.

I saw that episode also. It's definitely not what we're discussing here, but I have been meaning to google it and see what it is. If it doesn't boil until 300+*, it won't build pressure, and that's how he was able to just remove the cap. Waterless coolant is a very interesting concept.
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Old 01-19-2013, 06:46 AM   #13
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Evans (waterless) coolant has a much lower specific heat than water or water/coolant mix, and requires a larger radiator and higher flowing coolant pump. You also have to purge 100% of the water from the system, which is not easy to do.
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Old 01-19-2013, 10:46 PM   #14
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Use distilled deionized water not tap. Tap water varies so much place to place especially if it is well water or treated at a water treatment facility.
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Old 01-20-2013, 06:09 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flink...View Post
I use Amsoil Coolant Boost and for reasons I don't understand, the instructions explicitly say "use tap water, not distilled water".

I don't think I'd bother swapping out the coolant in your car unless you're having temperature issues. The main advantage of doing so is not killing people if you pop a hose, but everyone else out there will be running antifreeze...

Hmm interesting on the tap water info, I'll have to check what Water Wetter says.

I'm not having any temp issues. Just getting ready for all the planned track days this 2013, and figured it might be a nice cheap way to get some lower temps/less loss of power by swapping out coolant to H20.

Think it's a waste of time?
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Old 01-20-2013, 09:10 PM   #16
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Think it's a waste of time?

Don't know. From internet wisdom (lol) I'd expect a few degrees cooler, perhaps 5F when it's working hard. The thing to do of course is to get before-and-after data. That requires the same ambient temps and is Hard To Do
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Old 01-21-2013, 04:27 AM   #17
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i run water and lucas oil water wetter, noticed about a 10deg drop in overall temps (was at 210 and went down to 200) by the end of each run. Now i may not be on the track nearly as long, but when i am on the track i am over 5000 rpm the entire time.
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Old 01-21-2013, 08:55 AM   #18
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Old 01-21-2013, 09:15 AM   #19
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Re: Switching to water?

Did someone pull the "search" routine 17 or so legitimate replies into the thread?


No temp issues here. Switched to get away from Dexcool. Wetter has all the seal lube a system needs. 2 bottles of wetter and rest water down here in the devils inferno and everything is fine.
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Old 01-21-2013, 12:01 PM   #20
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Quote:
Did someone pull the "search" routine 17 or so legitimate replies into the thread?

He's clearly just trying to get his post count up based on his other replies.

Sorry for the OT here, carry on.
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Old 01-23-2013, 10:20 AM   #21
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Is this for a track only car, or a daily driver which will see a few HPDE events through the year?

If it's a daily driver which you'll use on occasion for HPDE events, just leave the coolant. If you're building a track only car for competition purposes, get the coolant out and go with water and WW.

If you're trying to reduce temps because you're running too hot, there's most likely an issue somewhere with the coolant system (fans, thermostat, air flow, waterpump, etc ...).
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Old 01-23-2013, 11:55 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO Drifter...View Post
i run water and lucas oil water wetter, noticed about a 10deg drop in overall temps (was at 210 and went down to 200) by the end of each run. Now i may not be on the track nearly as long, but when i am on the track i am over 5000 rpm the entire time.

Great info, thanks man. About the same expectations I'd have for temp decrease.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CoolAid...View Post
Did someone pull the "search" routine 17 or so legitimate replies into the thread?


No temp issues here. Switched to get away from Dexcool. Wetter has all the seal lube a system needs. 2 bottles of wetter and rest water down here in the devils inferno and everything is fine.

Sweet, definitely helpful. Did you use distilled or deionized water or?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoopalini...View Post
Is this for a track only car, or a daily driver which will see a few HPDE events through the year?

If it's a daily driver which you'll use on occasion for HPDE events, just leave the coolant. If you're building a track only car for competition purposes, get the coolant out and go with water and WW.

If you're trying to reduce temps because you're running too hot, there's most likely an issue somewhere with the coolant system (fans, thermostat, air flow, waterpump, etc ...).

It's a daily driver that only sees the following:
- Weekend drives and roadtrips
- Runs to the grocery store
- 10-14 DE track days a year

I'm not having any heating issues or coolant issues what so ever. Just looking for a cheap way to get some better cooling in the pony for those super hot track events in the summer here.

Sounds like it may be worth a shot.
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Old 01-23-2013, 12:02 PM   #23
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One thing to keep in mind with water only as coolant. Average temps will likely be lower due to water's increased specific heat vs. coolant mixture. However, there still may be small areas of localized boiling or hot spots, particularly in the upper part of the cylinder heads. This would not show up as an increased overall coolant temperature, because if there is boiling, less heat is being transferred to the circulating coolant, however the hot spots can and do contribute to detonation. Let's not forget that antifreeze substantially increases the boiling point of the coolant.
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Old 01-23-2013, 12:17 PM   #24
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coolant crossovers/steam vents would be a good recommendation to run 100% water full time for the above reasons.
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Old 01-23-2013, 12:58 PM   #25
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I ran 70% distilled, 30 dexcool, in the engine of my ecotec, any less didnt help anything. 90% distilled, 10% coolant in the heat exchangers for the blower worked for daily driving.
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Old 01-23-2013, 08:33 PM   #26
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I'm planning on running 25% antifreeze and 75% water for this next year, I'll let you know how it goes
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Old 01-26-2013, 06:44 PM   #27
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Well I whimped out.

Doing a flush tomorrow with 25% Antifreeze, 75% Distilled Water and two bottles of Water Wetter.

Mainly due to the fact that we go camping and hit freezing temps now be then - would suck to have the radiator crack.
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Old 01-26-2013, 06:59 PM   #28
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Old 02-02-2013, 05:58 AM   #29
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When I put the track car away for the winter, I drain a couple of quarts of water from the radiator and replace with coolant. That will protect the engine for temperatures below freezing. Before the first track event, I will flush and replace with water and water wetter.

I run a 15 psi radiator cap which should raise the boiling point of water to about 257 degrees (about 3 degrees per psi). My only worry is as mistermike said - localized hot spots. I monitor water temps while at the track and have not seen excessive temps.
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Old 02-03-2013, 09:27 PM   #30
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Running about 5 degrees cooler now during normal driving fyi
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