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Old 05-25-2009, 09:00 PM   #1
STOUT.GTO.2004
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Not satisfied with Torquer V2 as "street" cam. Too big?

Ok, this thread is going to be all personal preference, but i'm not satisfied yet with the torquer as a "street" cam. Dont get me wrong the cam screams up top around 4500-5500 rpms and produces excellent numbers, but really sucks mid-range and down low, off idle to 3500. The tune is on all around, has been checked several times, and I'm convinced it's as good as its going to get for now. It seems as if this cam has taken the "street" out of my car though, as it only wants to run at high rpms. I'm not looking to get the biggest numbers out there, but wanted a cam with nice gains for playin on the street all through the rpm range because I never go to the track. I think I went too big on my choice for a "street" cam. I haven't installed a F.A.S.T. intake/throttle body yet, but don't think that is going to solve my problem either, if not make the problem worse for things mid and down low. I know to gain up top one usually loses down low and understand that, would like to see better tq/hp numbers mid and down low.

Any suggestions on some different mods to try and help low to midrange with this cam or mabye even a different camshaft that is considered a bit more "streetable"? Thanks.
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Old 05-25-2009, 09:20 PM   #2
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what are the specs on the cam? I have a streetsweeper HT and I think its too tame for the street, lol.
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Old 05-25-2009, 09:33 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STOUT.GTO.2004...View Post
Ok, this thread is going to be all personal preference, but i'm not satisfied yet with the torquer as a "street" cam. Dont get me wrong the cam screams up top around 4500-5500 rpms and produces excellent numbers, but really sucks mid-range and down low, off idle to 3500. The tune is on all around, has been checked several times, and I'm convinced it's as good as its going to get for now. It seems as if this cam has taken the "street" out of my car though, as it only wants to run at high rpms. I'm not looking to get the biggest numbers out there, but wanted a cam with nice gains for playin on the street all through the rpm range because I never go to the track. I think I went too big on my choice for a "street" cam. I haven't installed a F.A.S.T. intake/throttle body yet, but don't think that is going to solve my problem either, if not make the problem worse for things mid and down low. I know to gain up top one usually loses down low and understand that, would like to see better tq/hp numbers mid and down low.

Any suggestions on some different mods to try and help low to midrange with this cam or mabye even a different camshaft that is considered a bit more "streetable"? Thanks.


What is your LSA on?

your specs should be 232/234 .595 .598

I had this same cam but on a 114LSA i really loved the cam, it was a great street cam for my car. But i also had this is an LS2 not an LS1.
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Old 05-26-2009, 02:10 AM   #4
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Any of the 224's

that cam is a mild cam, you have there....
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Old 05-26-2009, 02:20 AM   #5
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Instead of buying an off the shelf cam call up someone like Ed Curtis and have a custom grind cam made. You'll be happier in the long run and they don't run that much more than an off the shelf cam.
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Old 05-26-2009, 03:15 AM   #6
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Honestly your best bet is to buy some gears..Although u wont gain low end power it will get you to your range much faster
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Old 05-26-2009, 03:34 AM   #7
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You mean to tell me that a big cam isn't good for the street? Well by golly this is news to me. I mean, its not like I say it in every single cam thread I can find that too big a cam will make your car slow.
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Old 05-26-2009, 04:16 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STOUT.GTO.2004...View Post
I'm not looking to get the biggest numbers out there, but wanted a cam with nice gains for playin on the street all through the rpm range because I never go to the track.

i have the exact same goals as you, and i've been very close to buying this cam package on 114lsa all week for my ls2. i'll be putting a 3600 stall in it though, so that might help. i def don't want to have to make a 1/4 mi run to appreciate the gains on my mods. this is the first adverse report on this cam i've read, and i think i'm still gonna go with it... i don't want to go with too small of a cam and wish i went bigger later.
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Old 05-26-2009, 04:21 AM   #9
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There is something between big cams and small cams. Its called a medium cam.
Plus, you can always add heads to a cam to get another 25rwhp, if you aren't happy with the results.
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Old 05-26-2009, 04:32 AM   #10
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I love the T2 and daily drive my car, however I do have the LS2. Maybe you need to pick up a set of 243's at least. And I wouldn't call this a big cam. More in the medium range. Mines a 112 LSA btw.
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Old 05-26-2009, 04:33 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beach Goat...View Post
There is something between big cams and small cams. Its called a medium cam.
Plus, you can always add heads to a cam to get another 25rwhp, if you aren't happy with the results.

a lot of people consider the torquer 2 a medium cam. big is like 243/247 .629/.629... or even 238/242 is gonna be noticeably bigger than a 232/234. from what i've read tv2 is very medium. maybe the bigger end of medium but still. maybe he should've gone with the vrx3 or vrx4.
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Old 05-26-2009, 04:53 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Furious Goat...View Post
a lot of people consider the torquer 2 a medium cam. big is like 243/247 .629/.629... or even 238/242 is gonna be noticeably bigger than a 232/234. from what i've read tv2 is very medium. maybe the bigger end of medium but still. maybe he should've gone with the vrx3 or vrx4.

There's the thing...the definition of big keeps going up and up.

243/247 is like a 408 cam, that should never be considered for a stock ci motor. I'd say anything above 232 is big, and anything in the mid-upper 220's is medium. Anything smaller is a baby cam.

Then again, you can get a custom ground cam to behave differently than a off the shelf cam. Also the tune plays a part in driveability. But you can't make power appear magically, its just pure unchanging engine dynamics that dictates where a cam will make power, and a bigger cam sacrifices low end for top end, plain and simple.
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Old 05-26-2009, 06:10 AM   #13
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Its all personal preference. I would say to the OP that a 224 range cam is gonna give him everything he is looking for without all the drama.
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Old 05-26-2009, 06:22 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by offaxis...View Post
Its all personal preference. I would say to the OP that a 224 range cam is gonna give him everything he is looking for without all the drama.

224 or 228 at the most
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Old 05-26-2009, 06:31 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Beach Goat...View Post
There's the thing...the definition of big keeps going up and up. I'd say anything above 232 is big, and anything in the mid-upper 220's is medium... and a bigger cam sacrifices low end for top end, plain and simple.

true. hmmm, based on this guy's report, maybe i should be considering something smaller like a vrx4...

Quote:
Originally Posted by offaxis...View Post
Its all personal preference. I would say to the OP that a 224 range cam is gonna give him everything he is looking for without all the drama.

it seems most people get these cams and wish they went bigger after they get used to it...
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Old 05-26-2009, 06:35 AM   #16
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Truthfully, anything you do to your car you will get used to. Ask me how slow my 449rwhp feels after having it for 6 months.
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Old 05-26-2009, 06:56 AM   #17
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Quote:
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Truthfully, anything you do to your car you will get used to. Ask me how slow my 449rwhp feels after having it for 6 months.

damn i can relate to that statement.
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Old 05-26-2009, 07:07 AM   #18
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i love my torquer V2.

...its about the only thing from TS&P ive been satisfied with thus far, but hey... 1 for 6 isnt that bad when your used to cheering for houston sports teams.

i do agree that it sucks some of the low end life out of the LS1, but sweet jesus when it creeps up into the top of the tach, its like a friggin 150 shot kicking in.

i think the problem with your setup is the lack of a man pedal.


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Old 05-26-2009, 07:08 AM   #19
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where can one get the Spartan Spec'd 228/232 cam at?
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Old 05-26-2009, 07:15 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beach Goat...View Post
Truthfully, anything you do to your car you will get used to. Ask me how slow my 449rwhp feels after having it for 6 months.

Agreed.. Having the power I have for the past 2 yrs has really made me feel slow..

/off topic

I live at the beach now yet I haven't seen you yet

I see you got yourself a BOM.. Welcome to the club (I've been away for awhile so I don't know when you got it )

/end off topic
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Old 05-26-2009, 07:29 AM   #21
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i think the problem with your setup is the lack of a man pedal.


jmho.

He has the M6, is there some other man pedal I don't know about?
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Old 05-26-2009, 07:40 AM   #22
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I'm not saying that this cam sucks or that it is not doing what it is supposed to do. This thread was not made to bash the T2! It is actually freakin awesome up top and makes nice numbers. Like Offaxis said, lets leave the drama out of this. Not here to bash anything, just to compare notes.

I am just asking if anyone else with the LS1 feels the same way about the serious lack of low end / mid range power with this cam and what are some other suggestions for mods or even a new cam to reach my goal which is NOT to see who has the biggest numbers on paper, but rather have nice pull throughout the full rpm range. I like the suggestions for the 224 cam and have seen some nice flat curves through mid rpm range with that cam. I was actually considering the 224 cam before I went with the T2.

"Most of them are on your basic run of the mill XE or XE-R lobe, and the majority of them don't make any low end TQ." - Damian

Damian you made some nice educated points, and seem to see exactly what I'm talking about. Any suggestions on where to get a cam which you've described? How big of lift is that cam creating?
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Old 05-26-2009, 07:40 AM   #23
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Originally, I intended to go with a bit smaller cam since my car is a DD, but so far I love the V2.

The goat is a whole new animal and a blast to drive! JMO it's a very nice cam for a daily driver.
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Old 05-26-2009, 08:09 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTSnooks...View Post
He has the M6, is there some other man pedal I don't know about?

oh snapsauce!

my mind must still be full of alcohol from this weekend, i could have sworn he was talking about changing the stall out.

*after re-reading, turns out i am still drunk.
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Old 05-26-2009, 08:11 AM   #25
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*after re-reading, turns out i am still drunk.

I thought you gave that up
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Old 05-26-2009, 09:19 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damian...View Post
Lots of internet mechanic recommendations in here

First off, a 224 cam isn't the only solution to your problem. There's several cam choices that will make more power than a T2, and with much more midrange. For example, here's a custom grind of mine that made 409/395 through full exhaust, look at the midrange and the TQ curve..This car is a blast to drive on the street, even with 3:42 gears it'll snatch your guts back at 3000 rpms. This cam is similar to the T2 in terms of duration, only a little smaller.

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showth...referrerid=183

Here's another torquer removed and swapped for something that made more power everywhere in the curve spec'd by Pat G, but didn't go any smaller.




Not to knock TSP because I like those guys, and buy a lot of parts from them but I do not use their cams for this reason. Most of them are on your basic run of the mill XE or XE-R lobe, and the majority of them don't make any low end TQ. I've removed more Magic sticks than I care to remember because people weren't happy with the lack of low end power.

A 224 cam is great for the midrange, but with a little R&D you can actually have your cake and eat it too. Meaning, you can keep the top end charge and still make great TQ. Just takes more than throwing some cam specs on paper, giving it some fancy name, and calling it a great camshaft.

Thank you for this post, ESPECIALLY the last sentence. Maybe you can win some hearts and minds away from the donkey dick cams and back towards rationality and good old fashioned, low end, V8 torque.
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Old 05-26-2009, 10:08 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Beach Goat...View Post
Thank you for this post, ESPECIALLY the last sentence. Maybe you can win some hearts and minds away from the donkey dick cams and back towards rationality and good old fashioned, low end, V8 torque.

this is exactly what i had in mind when I went to Ed C for my custom grind cam.. I ended up with a 220/224 cam with over .600, which may be "small" by a lot of people's standards, but should make the cam much more fun to drive on the street, where I'm (and the OP) aren't at 5Krpm + all the time..
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Old 05-26-2009, 11:58 AM   #28
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/\ - That cam is a tad on the small side, but will make some nice off-idle power.

Quote:
Thank you for this post, ESPECIALLY the last sentence. Maybe you can win some hearts and minds away from the donkey dick cams and back towards rationality and good old fashioned, low end, V8 torque.

Man, I've been trying for years to get this point across. Unfortunately most people fall into the internet hype, only to be disappointed when their car makes 20 less rwhp than "the one they saw on the internet".
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Old 05-26-2009, 12:09 PM   #29
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I thought you gave that up

i did, for a few months. then i realized that i could enjoy it in moderation and still have a good time. now i can drink a beer or two, or a glass of wine, or a couple of drinks and not go overboard.
its a nice feeling, its as though i quit when i compare it to what i was taking in on a daily basis.

memorial day weekend floating the river, though... good god.
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Old 05-26-2009, 12:23 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Doric...View Post
I had a 224/220 .600 114 +4 in my LS1 and it was friggin' snappy off the line.

doesnt the LSA have a lot to do with where the power jumps in?

i thought the lower the LSA, the higher in the RPM range the power comes on.
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