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Old 05-12-2019, 06:12 PM   #31
lejambcr
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I'm certainly not an expert since the only car I have tuned is mine. But, yes, I left all the updates I had done to the MAF table in place when I converted the tune for VE mapping. I did the VE mapping conversion based on all the input I got from Notheubert, Lakegto, Hadagto etc within this thread. Those guys helped me a bunch. It worked like a charm, I made no changes to that tune when I installed the wideband I just added the Lambda channel input from the AEM gauge to my scanner list and started tweaking the high power VE's so that I got lambda's that matched the PE setting I had in the tune. I set my target AFR in the PE table to 1.15, yes a little rich but that was for safety. Then I tweaked the VE's so I got Lambda's of 0.87 which is of course the reciprocal of 1.15. Once I was happy with the VE's I reset the target PE AFR to 1.13 and called it good.
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Old 05-12-2019, 06:23 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lejambcr...View Post
I'm certainly not an expert since the only car I have tuned is mine. But, yes, I left all the updates I had done to the MAF table in place when I converted the tune for VE mapping. I did the VE mapping conversion based on all the input I got from Notheubert, Lakegto, Hadagto etc within this thread. Those guys helped me a bunch. It worked like a charm, I made no changes to that tune when I installed the wideband I just added the Lambda channel input from the AEM gauge to my scanner list and started tweaking the high power VE's so that I got lambda's that matched the PE setting I had in the tune. I set my target AFR in the PE table to 1.15, yes a little rich but that was for safety. Then I tweaked the VE's so I got Lambda's of 0.87 which is of course the reciprocal of 1.15. Once I was happy with the VE's I reset the target PF AFR to 1.13 and called it good.

Right on. I havent attempted to log anything yet. Just press space bar while the laptop is hooked up right? Any tips on what to log?
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Old 05-12-2019, 06:38 PM   #33
lejambcr
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Is the spacebar a 'start scan shortcut'? If so I wasn't aware of it....I just put the cursor over the red record button at the top of the scanner menu and click and that starts things recording. Setting up your scan list is kind of an art form/personal preference. The basic list that comes from the initial install of VCM Scanner on your laptop is pretty good but mostly you want to set up your HISTOGRAMs so that they mimic the tables in the tune you are trying to adjust. For example to tune VE using the narrow band's I built a histogram with RPM on the vertical axis and Kpa(manifold pressure) in the top horizontal axis and filled one table with STFT's and another with LTFT's. If you disable LTFT's then that table is filled with ZEROS and you can ignore it and just use STFT's. Most tuners use internal math equations in the scanner to calculate the new VE's based on the STFT's but since I'm a spreadsheet addict I built a spreadsheet to do all that math for me. Whats great about the VCM Scanner and Tuner software is that you can copy/paste into and out of EXCEL and the VCM Suite tables......very cool.

Last edited by lejambcr; 05-12-2019 at 06:53 PM.
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Old 05-12-2019, 06:48 PM   #34
lejambcr
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For wideband VE tuning when in Power Enrichment I just built another histogram with RPM and Manifoldpressure on the axis like before but I filled it with Lambda instead of STFT. Then I did simple ratio's of Lambda measured vs. Lambda target and applied those tweaks to the appropriate cells in the VE table, again using Microsoft Excel. This probably sounds complicated but once you get into it it makes perfect sense and goes really smoothly.....and its fun too.
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Old 05-13-2019, 10:56 AM   #35
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Thanks. Ill tinker with the scanner on my way home today just to figure out what i need.
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Old 05-13-2019, 11:10 AM   #36
lejambcr
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You won't be able to add the Lambda to the scan list until you get the wideband installed so don't get discouraged when you see you can get it into the list.
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Old 05-13-2019, 03:00 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lejambcr...View Post
You won't be able to add the Lambda to the scan list until you get the wideband installed so don't get discouraged when you see you can get it into the list.

No worries. I got tables built today, spark advance on rpm/map table, spark retard on rpm/map table, ltft & stft on rpm/map (which were already put together) so i made a ltft & stft vs maf as well to be able to keep an eye on.

Spacebar does start and stop recordings.

Much easier to understand the tables after seeing what was happening on my way home.
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Old 05-13-2019, 03:51 PM   #38
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You are well on your way. Also, the Spark tables are usually cylinder airmass vs. rpm. Make sure you have that histogram set up.
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Old 05-13-2019, 06:04 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by lejambcr...View Post
You are well on your way. Also, the Spark tables are usually cylinder airmass vs. rpm. Make sure you have that histogram set up.

thanks, ill get that setup for next time.

when making a table for LTFT/STFT MAF should it also be looking at cylinder airmass vs rpm?
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Old 05-13-2019, 07:50 PM   #40
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Here’s a real long answer to your simple question,
Histograms are most effective when you are working on a parameter that is based on 2 variables, like VE which is based on RPM and intake manifold pressure.
Generally, the best way to set up your histograms is to see how the parameter table is loaded/plotted in the tune file. But MAF is a little different. MAF airflow is based on a single parameter......the frequency it measures. The higher the frequency the higher the flow.
If you look at AIRFLOW in your tune you will see a couple of plots of airflow vs. MAF frequency. One is for the low frequency range and the other is for the high frequency range. Theoretically speaking MAF frequency doesn't directly care about RPM or throttle setting or manifold pressure, only airflow rate, but in reality MAF frequency can get effected by the modifications you make to the engine. Thats why its the first thing you play with to get proper fuel air ratio when you've made upgrades to the motor. Provided of course that you are not running an SD tune.
If your fuel trims are showing that the ECM is adding fuel then you need to raise the MAF flow by that percentage at that MAF frequency. If the ECM is removing fuel then you need to lower MAF flow at that MAF frequency. I’m sure more experienced tuners have a better way but here’s what I did….
For NON-POWER ENRICHMENT CLOSED LOOP TUNING using the NARROWBAND O2 sensors:
This is usually for tweaking the low frequency MAF table…..Make a histogram which has dynamic airflow on one axis and MAF Frequency on the other axis. Then fill the histogram with LTFT’s or STFT’s if you’ve disabled LTFT. What you will get is a histogram with a diagonal line of data across the middle. Then read the histogram at a certain MAF frequency lets say 3100hz for example (which is near idle), what LTFT do you have in that box. If its +5% then you want to increase the flow in your tune file by 5% at that MAF frequency….if its say, -5% then you want to decrease the flow in your tune file by 5% at that MAF frequency…..is this making any sense? Like I said, I’m sure more experienced tuners have better ways to do it but this worked fine for me because I had plenty of time on my hands….I wasn’t on the clock….. LOL
For WOT POWER ENRICHMENT Tuning using the WIDEBAND O2 sensors:
This is usually for tweaking the high frequency MAF table …….also make a histogram which has dynamic airflow on one axis and MAF Frequency on the other axis but now fill it with LAMBDA instead of STFT. You want LAMBDA to be .90 (normally aspirated pump gas engines) when running in the power enrichment range. So now look at your LAMBDA’s in the histogram, if they are running .95 then you need to add 5% to airflow at that MAF frequency, if you have LAMBDA’s of .85 then you can take away 5% of airflow at that MAF frequency …….Is any of this still making sense????

See attached pictures.
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Last edited by lejambcr; 05-14-2019 at 03:58 AM.
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Old 05-14-2019, 05:37 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lejambcr...View Post
Here’s a real long answer to your simple question,
Histograms are most effective when you are working on a parameter that is based on 2 variables, like VE which is based on RPM and intake manifold pressure.
Generally, the best way to set up your histograms is to see how the parameter table is loaded/plotted in the tune file. But MAF is a little different. MAF airflow is based on a single parameter......the frequency it measures. The higher the frequency the higher the flow.
If you look at AIRFLOW in your tune you will see a couple of plots of airflow vs. MAF frequency. One is for the low frequency range and the other is for the high frequency range. Theoretically speaking MAF frequency doesn't directly care about RPM or throttle setting or manifold pressure, only airflow rate, but in reality MAF frequency can get effected by the modifications you make to the engine. Thats why its the first thing you play with to get proper fuel air ratio when you've made upgrades to the motor. Provided of course that you are not running an SD tune.
If your fuel trims are showing that the ECM is adding fuel then you need to raise the MAF flow by that percentage at that MAF frequency. If the ECM is removing fuel then you need to lower MAF flow at that MAF frequency. I’m sure more experienced tuners have a better way but here’s what I did….
For NON-POWER ENRICHMENT CLOSED LOOP TUNING using the NARROWBAND O2 sensors:
This is usually for tweaking the low frequency MAF table…..Make a histogram which has dynamic airflow on one axis and MAF Frequency on the other axis. Then fill the histogram with LTFT’s or STFT’s if you’ve disabled LTFT. What you will get is a histogram with a diagonal line of data across the middle. Then read the histogram at a certain MAF frequency lets say 3100hz for example (which is near idle), what LTFT do you have in that box. If its +5% then you want to increase the flow in your tune file by 5% at that MAF frequency….if its say, -5% then you want to decrease the flow in your tune file by 5% at that MAF frequency…..is this making any sense? Like I said, I’m sure more experienced tuners have better ways to do it but this worked fine for me because I had plenty of time on my hands….I wasn’t on the clock….. LOL
For WOT POWER ENRICHMENT Tuning using the WIDEBAND O2 sensors:
This is usually for tweaking the high frequency MAF table …….also make a histogram which has dynamic airflow on one axis and MAF Frequency on the other axis but now fill it with LAMBDA instead of STFT. You want LAMBDA to be .90 (normally aspirated pump gas engines) when running in the power enrichment range. So now look at your LAMBDA’s in the histogram, if they are running .95 then you need to add 5% to airflow at that MAF frequency, if you have LAMBDA’s of .85 then you can take away 5% of airflow at that MAF frequency …….Is any of this still making sense????

See attached pictures.

Yeah that makes more sense. Not sure i need to monitor the MAF tune since its somewhat already dialed in but it wouldnt hurt to have the option to check it.

Hopefully i can get the wideband installed soon and just start with it vs using the narrowbands.
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