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Discussion Starter #1
My impulse blue 6 speed GTO was towed to the dealership yesterday due to a failed clutch linkage. The linkage failed where it attaches to the pedal. That attachment is PLASTIC?

It is just a matter of time before your plastic clutch linkage attachment fails!
:mad:
Crawl under your dash and check it out, this is crap.
 

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647204 said:
My impulse blue 6 speed GTO was towed to the dealership yesterday due to a failed clutch linkage. The linkage failed where it attaches to the pedal. That attachment is PLASTIC?

It is just a matter of time before your plastic clutch linkage attachment fails!
:mad:
Crawl under your dash and check it out, this is crap.

Did you have any 'clicking' at the top or bottome of pedal extension? I get that maybe 30% of the time I use the clutch.

_DM
 

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dmonty said:
Did you have any 'clicking' at the top or bottome of pedal extension? I get that maybe 30% of the time I use the clutch.

_DM
No, everything was fine and smooth up until the failure.
 

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May I quote you on that?
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The linkage must be the companion piece to the rubber U-joints. Hope there's no Jello motor mounts lurking in there.
 

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Not An Isolated Incident!!!

Yellow Jacket M6 said:
Hope this is an isolated incident.
NOT AN ISOLATED INCIDENT!!! See my post from ls1tech.com...

Warning to GTO M6 Owners...

I now have about 1000 more miles on my car, and the fix the dealer did has worked so far... Hopefully there is a recall on this so I can go get the real fix when GM decides on it...
 

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Plastic linkage

647204 said:
My impulse blue 6 speed GTO was towed to the dealership yesterday due to a failed clutch linkage. The linkage failed where it attaches to the pedal. That attachment is PLASTIC?

It is just a matter of time before your plastic clutch linkage attachment fails!
:mad:
Crawl under your dash and check it out, this is crap.
I'm not happy about this either. It's one thing to have plastic grilles (which I don't like), or to put plastic hinges on a glovebox etc. (which also wear out, but I guess they expect you to get rid of the vehicle before it fails. I installed metal hinges on the console of my old Jimmy when the lid fell off). I feel that very careful deliberation needs to be done by engineering before substituting plastic for metal in such a critical application. My dealer says this:

"MOST VEHICLES BUILT IN THE LAST TWENTY
YEARS HAVE THIS TYPE OF CLUTCH LINKAGE IF THEY DO NOT
HAVE A HYDRAULIC SYSTEM. DO NOT BE ALARMED. THEY ARE
RELIABLE UNLESS YOU ARE EXTREMELY HARD ON THE CLUTCH.
IT ALSO HAS A PLASTIC INTAKE MANIFOLD AND MANY OTHER
PARTS OF LIGHTWEIGHT MATERIALS. THE CAR IS ALREADY
HEAVY ENOUGH WITHOUT MAKING IT ALL OUT OF METAL.
MUSTANGS HAD THIS TYPE OF LINKAGE AT ONE TIME."

I have to wonder why Mustangs DON'T have this now.....
 

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Can't help ya, Sorry.
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A properly engineered plastic part is often a far better substitute for metal. Our intake manifolds are a prime example of this.

Having said that, I agree that many of the parts on this vehical were poorly engineered. I am put off by the center console latch and hinge.
 

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The problem is that most of the engineers designing and making decisions on designs are 1) under tremendous cost saving constraints 2) have never changed their own oil - let alone done any serious work on a car and 3) don't have real answerability over failure of design issues because there is always somebody else blamed if a real incident occurs. For example in this case, I'd be willing to bet there is something 'out of spec' with either the material or the dimensions on the plastic piece in question. It probably doesn't cause the part to fail though - it fails because it's plastic and shouldn't be used in such a stressful situation. If it were to get serious enough to be a safety recall, the supplier of the part would be blamed and have to take financial responsibility because the part isn't exactly to print - regardless of whether the issue caused the failure. And the supplier can't fight it because a) technically the parts they supplied didn't meet the requirements and b) GM can lawyer small to medium sized companies to death.
Dan
 

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Can't help ya, Sorry.
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I haven't had a change to look at the part in question, you may be right. But plastic parts that are well designed are often superiror to steal. Always lighter. It could be that the molds were running too cold or hot when the part was formed, this would affect the way they formed and the streignth of the finished part. It could be a resin (type of plastic) subsutution that caused this. It may even be a poorly designed part..
 

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Gto Dead, Attn M6 Owners!!!!

sxty8goats said:
I haven't had a chance to look at the part in question, you may be right. But plastic parts that are well designed are often superiror to steal. Always lighter. It could be that the molds were running too cold or hot when the part was formed, this would affect the way they formed and the streignth of the finished part. It could be a resin (type of plastic) subsutution that caused this. It may even be a poorly designed part..
My clutch would occasionally 'pop' ever since delivery. Last week I took her in to analyze the source. New linkage was ordered and arrived Wednesday (6/23). I made an appt to get it fixed for Friday (6/25). Dropped the goat off at 8:30 AM. Got a call around 1PM that the work was done. Everything was fine and dandy at this point...

I chatted briefly with the service manager about the stupid plastic part and he aslo gave me info about my leaking freeze plug. I then got in the car and drove off the lot. I remember thinking that the 'fixed' clutch felt way too easy to push and about 2/3 of travel was just play and would only catch about the last 2" of travel. I told myself that I would be returning to get this adjusted because I didnt like the feel at all and wanted more pressure returned from the pedal.

So I take it down the highway to return to work and decide to take a little 'extended drive' to test the fix. It was hot as hell yesterday so I decide to stop at a Sunoco (5 miles from the dealer) to get an Arizona tea. As I pull into the turning lane and push in the clutch to take it out of gear the pedal makes a final pop about where the clutch would catch and the pedal falls flat to the floor!!!! FIVE FRIGGIN MILES!!!!

Now I am MAD!!!! I manuever the unpowered vehicle into the lot on a side where the flatbed can get in front of me and call my service manager. I get a recording. I AM MADDER!!! I call back and ask the operator to connect me with the person in charge of the service dept and get another recording. NOW I AM MAD AS HELL!!!! I call back again and tell the operator to connect me with whoever is in charge of the service dept and to not connect me to a machine because I demand to speak with a human being immediately!!! She complies and shortly I am talking with a service manager. Being that the car is the GTO everyone on the lot is aware when one is present and he knew I just left the dealer. I told him what happened and he gives me the number to Roadside Assistance.

I call assistance and get a flatbed dispatched. About 1.5 HOURS later the truck arrives and the driver has a perplexed look and makes a remark about "they still cant build them things right." Whatever dude, get me on the truck. Item to note here: Flatbedding a GTO must be done on a FLAT surface and even then the bumpers olny have about a 1/4 inch clearance, literally!!!

We get the goat on the truck and head back to the dealer. Have you ever seen that Staples commercial where the truck is going down the highway and is surrounded by cars circling around it? Well that was the situation on the return trip to the dealer. Having a GTO lifted up about 5 feet going down the highway in traffic can really draw some attention and is NOT GOOD ADVERTISING PONTIAC!!!

We get back to the dealer and unload the car. The SM asks for a detailed description of what happened when it broke. I describe the situation while their top tech is under the dash inspecting. He popped the plastic piece back on the clutch pedal stud and is able to get it moving and pulls it in the garage. We walk in the garage and the tech shows me my previous linkage. There is a cylinder with a plastic plunger that has a round eye that mounts over the stud on the pedal lever and has 2 little plastic tabs to hold on to the stud. The tabs are similar to the ones that hold plastic cased together on radios and such. I have never seen these tabs on moving components before and now I know why. The tech remarks that "this is a shitty desing". NO SHIT HUH??

They then place a call to GM engineering to figure out how to fix this permanently and order me a rental. F*&K MAN!!! I have been waiting all week for the weekend to enjoy my goat and NOW I HAVE A NISSAN ALTIMA IN MY GARAGE!!!

I highly recommend that all M6 owners bring their rides in to have this inspected!!! I brought mine in because of the occasional clicking and the fix for that BROKE MY CAR. The removed (original) piece had signs of wear already where the hole for the stud had changed from a circle to an oval. Keep in mind I only have 2000 miles on the car!!!

This design needs to be fixed quick like otherwise you will start seeing many (maybe yours) goats riding on flatbeds.

_DM
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Pontiac replaced my linkage and after the Tech. excercised it a couple of times, the new linkage failed as well. They finally deturmined that it was the clutch pedal itself and after more than a week in the shop, I have my GTO back. I do not trust driving this car and I feel that this is still a safety issue!!!
The clutch pedal has a steel pin or dowel that attaches to the plastic end of the clutch linkage. Upon my own inspection, I could see that this steel pin somewhat "floats" in the clutch pedal. A large steel spring holds it in place on the opposite end of the plastic linkage side. As I depressed the pedal, I can see the pin "walk" or move around. This movement caused the hole where the pin resides to become larger and out of round which resulted in the linkage failure after 3400 miles.
The new steel pin now has a blob of grease where it resides in the new clutch pedal, obviously with the intent to keep the wear down. It will again be just a matter of time before that blob of grease is gone and the clutch fails again.
I have been talking to a GM Corp. figure head about this issue and I am not happy with this "fix".
Pontiac, I either want a robust, safe, permanant clutch linkage/pedal design or I WANT MY MONEY BACK!!!
 

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Does anybody have any idea why these 2 people have this issue and no other M6 owners have? Don't take this the wrong way because I certainly feel for you guys - but seriously there's a lot of cars with a lot of miles on this same design with no problems. Both of you have had the failure twice. It makes me think there's something different with your cars.
Dan
 

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This is what I was thinking

DANSLS1 said:
Does anybody have any idea why these 2 people have this issue and no other M6 owners have? Don't take this the wrong way because I certainly feel for you guys - but seriously there's a lot of cars with a lot of miles on this same design with no problems. Both of you have had the failure twice. It makes me think there's something different with your cars.
Dan
It would seem we would all have the problem.
 

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DANSLS1 said:
Does anybody have any idea why these 2 people have this issue and no other M6 owners have? Don't take this the wrong way because I certainly feel for you guys - but seriously there's a lot of cars with a lot of miles on this same design with no problems. Both of you have had the failure twice. It makes me think there's something different with your cars.
Dan
It not just us 2 that have had the linkage fail. I know of at least 2 more that have had this happen. One had the clutch make a popping noise 3 days before the failure and the other just failed without warning.

FYI: If this does happen it is highly possible to put the plastic part of the plunger back onto the stud that is on the clutch lever. THIS IS A TEMPORARY FIX because once the little tabs get busted out of the plastic piece it will not lock in place again. This should allow you to get the car someplace safe, preferably a large lot so you can get flatbedded. Try to find some 2x4's or something to fit under the wheels while waiting for the tow. Loading the goat onto the truck brings the bumpers to within 1/4" of scraping and if you are on uneven ground this may be worse.

My dealer had my 3rd linkage assy overnighted to them and hopefully I will get her back really soon, especially with a 3 day weekend in sight!!!

Good luck all!!
_DM
 

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So far, no problems, but I will keep a keen ear (or should I say foot) on the subject at hand. You would think that at a pivot point where it gets a lot of wear and tear GM/Holden would use a strong conection (say carbon fiber/kevlar/titanium). For such a small item it wouldn't be a very expensive fix!
 

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What are the last 6 digits of the VIN #'s of the 2 cars involved? Maybe there was a "break" in the production line just like the thunk in the trunk issue. Mine is 247,XXX and I had no problems with the thunk problem because it was fixed prior to delivery.

I will look carefully with a flashlight down there when I get back from work to inspect this part. I only have 125 miles so far in the goat and the clutch feels fine.

Thank you for sharing this problem so we could all benefit from it and hopefully force GM to address it properly and not band aid fix it.
 
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