Having a hard time deciding or not deciding on a cam for my '05 m6!! I see alot of you on here running the hpe-s cam. I heard the s cam works good in the m6's while i heard the c cam works good in the auto's, but i've seen some people running c cams in their m6's!! plus what lope? i see alot of 112's and 115's running. i want to take it on long trips w/o having too bad of gas mileage or performance. I like a good out of the hole cam but i want a topend for the 50mph downshifts hehe:turbonaug Am i asking for 2 much?? I plan on running headers, exh,cai,udp,plugs. You guys r great on here and any info greatly appreciated!!!:gears:
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I wouldnt expect good mileage or great low end performance outta either. If you just have to have the biggest cam...sure, go with it. But I would go smaller. For what you explained, I'd look into maybe something in a 222-226 range. And you dont have to have mondo lift for good performance. But to each his own. My cam (small by todays standards) gets around 12mpg city/16 hiway.
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This has been a very successful package for the LS2 combos. No drivability issues, easy to tune and with the right peripherals, has no effect on mileage...1QUIK LS2 said:
The "REBEL-TQ"
LSX Hydraulic Roller Camshaft Kit
Includes:
"REBEL-TQ" Camshaft
Specs: 224*-228*-111*-.600"-.600"
FTI Gen-3 Dual Valve Springs
FTI Hardened Spring Locators
FTI Ti Retainers
FTI Valve Locks
Viton Valve Seals
FTI Pro-Series Pushrods
$925 shipped!
BIG TORQUE and broad street power for an LS2 engine.
Great sounding "muscle car" lope!
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Ed,EDC said:
Couple of questions:
1.) What does the DCR end up being on an LS2 with stock heads (and how much advance is ground in to get there)?
2.) Do you have a graph of one on an LS2? I know you hate dynos, but I'm not looking for absolute numbers. I just want to see the curve.
3.) Do you have a video or sound clip of the post-tune lope?
Thanks.
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Never calculated it. It's not *that* important of a factor in the application the profile was designed. Maybe I should, but I don't place that much emphasis on DCR like some people do. After all, this is not a racecar application. Only a street car...CycloneGTO said:
Guess I could ask for some sheets from customers/dealers but since I don't put a lot of faith in the whole dyno battles, I don't ask for them. Looks like it's a great marketing tool for people hung up on them so I should ask for them from now on...
Nope...
Again... lope is only a sound. I prefer results...
Ed
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Thanks for the replies Ed. I'm not sure what I said to put you on the defensive, but I was just being curious. Didn't mean any offense.
Here's a couple of follow up thoughts:
Regarding DCR:
I've heard you say before that we shouldn't focus on a single aspect of the cam and rather should focus on how everything works together. I certainly agree with what you are saying. However, I took that to mean that we should understand all the properties of a cam in order to understand how they work together rather than just focusing on the duration, lift and LSA. With that said, I'd still like to know the DCR if you don't mind calculating it.
Regarding Dyno Graphs:
I tried to preface my request, but I guess I didn't do a very good job. I wasn't looking for a dyno war. I wasn't even interested in peak numbers. I just wanted to know how the power was spread throughout the RPM range. I'm trying to find the right compromise between low end torque and max power, which will be different from person to person. In my case, I won't even pay much attention to the actual numbers, just the shape of the curve. In fact, if you don't want to post it to avoid the dyno wars, you could just email it to me.
The dyno may not be the best tool for understanding the properties of a cam, but it's certainly better than buying a cam based on hearsay. Even the track isn't a good indicator of the performance of a cam for someone who is interested in low end torque for a street car. The track would only be a good indicator for someone looking for a peak power race cam.
And based on how highly regarded your cams are, it probably would be a good marketing tool to show some dyno graphs as you suggested, especially if the cam is similar to another popular one except for a significant increase in torque in a certain RPM range.
Regarding lope:
Again, I'm trying to evaluate the entire package. I certainly didn't mean to imply I would buy a cam based on how it made the car sound. I wanted to get an idea of how this cam would affect the daily driveability of the car. Hearing how the idle ended up after a tune would give me a rough idea. If you don't have a sound clip, then you don't. No big deal. No need to defend why you don't have it by shooting down the question.
Again, thanks for the replies. I've learned a lot from reading your posts on this board.
Here's a couple of follow up thoughts:
Regarding DCR:
I've heard you say before that we shouldn't focus on a single aspect of the cam and rather should focus on how everything works together. I certainly agree with what you are saying. However, I took that to mean that we should understand all the properties of a cam in order to understand how they work together rather than just focusing on the duration, lift and LSA. With that said, I'd still like to know the DCR if you don't mind calculating it.
Regarding Dyno Graphs:
I tried to preface my request, but I guess I didn't do a very good job. I wasn't looking for a dyno war. I wasn't even interested in peak numbers. I just wanted to know how the power was spread throughout the RPM range. I'm trying to find the right compromise between low end torque and max power, which will be different from person to person. In my case, I won't even pay much attention to the actual numbers, just the shape of the curve. In fact, if you don't want to post it to avoid the dyno wars, you could just email it to me.
The dyno may not be the best tool for understanding the properties of a cam, but it's certainly better than buying a cam based on hearsay. Even the track isn't a good indicator of the performance of a cam for someone who is interested in low end torque for a street car. The track would only be a good indicator for someone looking for a peak power race cam.
And based on how highly regarded your cams are, it probably would be a good marketing tool to show some dyno graphs as you suggested, especially if the cam is similar to another popular one except for a significant increase in torque in a certain RPM range.
Regarding lope:
Again, I'm trying to evaluate the entire package. I certainly didn't mean to imply I would buy a cam based on how it made the car sound. I wanted to get an idea of how this cam would affect the daily driveability of the car. Hearing how the idle ended up after a tune would give me a rough idea. If you don't have a sound clip, then you don't. No big deal. No need to defend why you don't have it by shooting down the question.
Again, thanks for the replies. I've learned a lot from reading your posts on this board.
CycloneGTO said:
Wheeww...I was starting to think I was alone here. I've never heard so many people concerned with how a cam sounds versus how well it works
and don't misunderstand Ed. From what I've read here he's just your typical "in your face (ie: very opinionated) northeastern type". :stickpoke For you southern guys it seems abrasive but it's normal.
Jeff
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Thanks for the heads up. I certainly didn't take any offense. I just wanted to make sure Ed knew I genuinely wanted more info vs. looking for ammo to bash his cam or something.JeffP said:
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I have the HPE C-cam. times and video in sig
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1QUIK LS2 said:
Looks like you are getting a lot of good answers already. I am running the S-cam in my m6 and I love it. Just this past weekend took it on a long trip and the car did great MPG was not bad (21-22) most of the time if I was keeping my foot out of it
This cam setup is what is good for my car. The S-cam is a great Top end cam and has good lope while preserving drive-ability.With that being said after reading 100's of threads on this subject I would just get with a few of the sponsers on the left.. AZPS, HPE, EDC, ect... From what I have been reading it seems that the best thing to do is get with them and talk to them about what you want in a setup. They all do a very good job with working with people on the right setup. Hope this helps a little cause you might have already searched and saw how some of these cam threads can get. If you have anymore questions about the S-Cam though I will answer what I can
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CycloneGTO said:
1) I'll try to calculate the DCR using stock LS2 parameters. Later tonight...
2) I don't care much for dyno charts because no one does them properly for a cam like this. How many dyno charts have you seen start at <2000 RPM vs >4000 RPM? Especially when the "big cam" wars start. Street cams need to be tested and TUNED from <2000 RPM and up. THEN tuned on the road. Otherwise, you're just BSing the customer. I know most of the shops I work with do this but that is because they are more experienced in providing "more" than just a tune. They are providing a complete package...
If you want to see some typical "shapes" of the curves my combos provide, look for Nic D's 2004 AFR205/custom cam package. He just finished it up. Then there's Greeny5005 and his ETP215/custom cam LS1 combo. Just finished is JJW's latest rendition of his 403 with a small cam/AFR 225 head package. You'll see a trend and a reason why I prefer that the shops I work with, not post the dyno sheets. All it does is start flame wars because someone will always misread the chart and say "my cam makes 5 more HP than yours"...
3) Lope is easy... More overlap equates to more lope. I do a lot of Cobra kit car packages that "want" the old Shelby "rumpty-rump" without all the drivability issues. I provide it.
Again... Each person has their own idea of lope vs power. The Cobra guys want 25 MPG and a "rump" in their idle. Others want NOTHING at all and a few ask for the really stupid stuff.
That's why I do ten times as many custom designs versus the "shelf" stuff...
Ed
Thx again all for the replies!! Ed, I'm looking too at performance than the lope. I just want a good reliable combo for my ls2. Not real radical, but not too soft either. plan on using my stock heads, but the headers,cai, exhaust and stuff i mentioned earlier with a good tune of course is what my plans are for now. Yes, once in awhile a get the heavy right foot syndrome hehe lol and just want to feel the power there when i stomp on it, but at the same time keep it somewhat streetable!! :gears: Thx all again!!
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anybody have any idea on witch vette cams you can swap in the ls1.
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